Div 1 Relegation???

[a for effort]

Re: Div 1 Relegation???

From a Division 2 promotion perspective, the three year rolling average makes for an interesting battle between Thomson and Manifold (The only two sides who should realistically be considered for promotion). Thomson won the club championship this year, while Manifold finished second. The previous season Thomson were somewhere in the top 3-4 of division 2, while Manifold were a fair way down in the division 1 club championship. The season before that, Thomson were dead last in division 1 while Manifold were in the top 2-3 of division 2.

It will be pretty tight between the two teams in this regard, and given that both clubs don't have any apparent off-field issues to lose points for, it could be what decides who goes up.

 

[cheer_cheer]

Re: Div 1 Relegation???

From a Division 2 promotion perspective, the three year rolling average makes for an interesting battle between Thomson and Manifold (The only two sides who should realistically be considered for promotion). Thomson won the club championship this year, while Manifold finished second. The previous season Thomson were somewhere in the top 3-4 of division 2, while Manifold were a fair way down in the division 1 club championship. The season before that, Thomson were dead last in division 1 while Manifold were in the top 2-3 of division 2.

It will be pretty tight between the two teams in this regard, and given that both clubs don't have any apparent off-field issues to lose points for, it could be what decides who goes up.

yes it would be tight between these two clubs, based on the above it might appear that Manifold would just have their heads in front but it may come down to junior numbers over the previous seasons.

 

[crktluva]

Re: Div 1 Relegation???

having had a lot of experience with GCA over the years, i will tell you this, and im open and invite criticism if any of you feel i am wrong.

They will alter, change, manipulate what ever points sytems or regulations they feel required in order to achieve what they want when they want. its been done in the past and will happen again in the future. the basic system of promotion and relegation thru club championship points should be the only way its done. shouldnt the strongest clubs pay div 1, then the next strongest play div 2 regardless of their club rooms etc. The GCA also have a rule in place that they will do everything they can to ensure clubs in the barwon zone have a place to play, hence the reason for taking on the churches comp years back and the problem you now have with some div 2 being non turf. if they follow their rule, which they may or may not depending on how they feel at the time, they should take on SLCA clubs also. but nothing will shock me, div 1 and 2 should definitely be turf, and the rest just play each other. this whole 3 or 5 year thing exists purely to give the rabble that is GCA flexibilty when it suits them. there was nothing wrong and nobody complained when it was just simple relegation on points.

 

[Renny24]

Re: Div 1 Relegation???

having had a lot of experience with GCA over the years, i will tell you this, and im open and invite criticism if any of you feel i am wrong.

They will alter, change, manipulate what ever points sytems or regulations they feel required in order to achieve what they want when they want. its been done in the past and will happen again in the future. the basic system of promotion and relegation thru club championship points should be the only way its done. shouldnt the strongest clubs pay div 1, then the next strongest play div 2 regardless of their club rooms etc. The GCA also have a rule in place that they will do everything they can to ensure clubs in the barwon zone have a place to play, hence the reason for taking on the churches comp years back and the problem you now have with some div 2 being non turf. if they follow their rule, which they may or may not depending on how they feel at the time, they should take on SLCA clubs also. but nothing will shock me, div 1 and 2 should definitely be turf, and the rest just play each other. this whole 3 or 5 year thing exists purely to give the rabble that is GCA flexibilty when it suits them. there was nothing wrong and nobody complained when it was just simple relegation on points.

Crktluva, i agree with most of what you are saying and the Club Championship system does give a lot of transparency with regards to promotion/relegation. However, obviously what the league is trying to do with the assessment system is make sure that a particular club is not just ready to compete in Div 1 on the field but that their club as a whole is strong enough to compete off the field; ie. admin, junior program, turf, etc. Clubs also are given a fair idea of where they are falling down and an obvious blue print of how and where they need to get better. Surely when GSM were relegated, the first thing they should have set about rectifying was their junior program. I know at St Peters and Thomson, Highton and Mano in recent years would have certainly seen where their own individual shortcomings were and set about improving. For most clubs in the league, even the traditional powerhouses such as Newtown, North, etc the on-field results tend to be cyclical. Develop some good plans and blueprints on how to run the club off the field and hopefully their will be a flow-on effect. To an outsiders' eye it certainly looks as though this is what's happening at South Barwon at present. I know that Daz and the boys have strived hard to get the club on the right track, to the point that the on-field form is not purely by accident. I'm not having a go at certain clubs here but recruit an all-star team, splash the cash around and get some big results on field will see you do well in club championship and then you will get promoted. However, don't fix things off the field and your infrastructure can't support your club when things go pear shaped with your results. In this respect, i can certainly see the league's angle. Wasn't it Newcomb FC that won two flags recently and once again are on the verge of folding? On-field success guarantees nothing.

 

[crktluva]

Re: Div 1 Relegation???

i hear what ya saying renny, on field success is impossible if your club is in dissaray. players just leave and then ya on field is crap again. so i would say were both on the same track. The only variant in it all is the GCA have their favourites and egos in place, therefore it will never be completely transparent.

 

[Look here]

Re: Div 1 Relegation???

Personally I don't mind the assessment system as opposed to promotion/relegation based on on-field results. Given that juniors are (or should be) the cornerstone of all clubs, I'm a little surprised full points in this area are based on having only (at least) 2 junior sides - I'd have thought at least 1 side in each of the 4 age groups (as well as Milo in2cricket) would be mandatory for full points.

I know the GCA1 relegated club is based on the rolling average, but is the GCA2 promoted club also, or just the current season's points?

 

[cheer_cheer]

Re: Div 1 Relegation???

Personally I don't mind the assessment system as opposed to promotion/relegation based on on-field results. Given that juniors are (or should be) the cornerstone of all clubs, I'm a little surprised full points in this area are based on having only (at least) 2 junior sides - I'd have thought at least 1 side in each of the 4 age groups (as well as Milo in2cricket) would be mandatory for full points.

I know the GCA1 relegated club is based on the rolling average, but is the GCA2 promoted club also, or just the current season's points?

GCA2 club is based on rolling average also. That is why it is so close this season with Thomson and Manifold.

 

[Babies Arm]

Re: Div 1 Relegation???

well at the start of the year certain thomson people were saying that they didnt want to up to div1, not sure what the feeling is now maybe rissole can fill us in more

 

[The Truth 18]

Re: Div 1 Relegation???

Just love it how newcomb allways is in the mix. The donkies that run the gca will want them out no doubt this is the opportunaty they have been looking for. what about GCA SORRY GEELONG CITY oh sorry and i hope AGG GETS wind of this because while he has a say city could fold and hed still have them in divi one. THOMSON may well come up for the season realy good div 2 side but will struggle. If your a side on the border you will always be a target.
GCA have no idea you watch they will change the structure again. Im hearing 2 divisons and hard wicket clubs can head back to the sticks and sort themselves out as the souther liegh mo again.

 

[crktluva]

Re: Div 1 Relegation???

Just love it how newcomb allways is in the mix. The donkies that run the gca will want them out no doubt this is the opportunaty they have been looking for. what about GCA SORRY GEELONG CITY oh sorry and i hope AGG GETS wind of this because while he has a say city could fold and hed still have them in divi one. THOMSON may well come up for the season realy good div 2 side but will struggle. If your a side on the border you will always be a target.
GCA have no idea you watch they will change the structure again. Im hearing 2 divisons and hard wicket clubs can head back to the sticks and sort themselves out as the souther liegh mo again.

huh!!! use some punctuation mate and we might understand a bit more. but ya right, they will always change it to suit themselves. boot them out at AGM if you have people willing to do it, while there is nobody else willing to do it, all clubs will have to put up with these fools.

 

[The Truth 18]

Re: Div 1 Relegation???

crkyluva,

I agree with a post you put up earlier that i hadnt read. All div 1 & 2 should be turf, the 3rd divison should be hard wicket and a place for clubs to build themselves up to play in higher divisions.

I'll take you back a few years when newcomb and bell park were the stand alone turf teams in div 3. They played all home games, the gca backed the clubs because they had a vision to play div 1 cricket. Newcomb got there bell park droped off a little bit. The system worked well then, then the gca changed it and its now is the joke that it is.
I hear St.Albans will be comming into the comp, i just hope that they are made to do there penance in div 3. Guild would be pretty pissed if they went into div2. Anyway my point is they had it write back then it was purely a club championship system, if you win that it proves that your club as a whole on the field is strong. You need your best teams in the top divisions, that will make div 2 stronger again. As it stands due to the constant changes, division one ist what it used to be, it's highly overated.

 

[The Truth 18]

Re: Div 1 Relegation???

I've read here that Newcomb & District have asked to be relagated. If this is true there will be 2 brothers that will never play at the club again.

For the select few people that have worked there arses off to get the club there, then to just give it up without a fight is a total joke.

The leaders of the club need to have questions asked of them if this is true. I can tell you as an insider that the club has alot of young tallent, but yes it does drop off as you go down the grades.
Butt to ask to be relagated is just not on. With negativity like this around the club it has no hope of getting better.

Just one other this S.Anderson did a fantastic job leading the club. With the crap he put up with from certain people on a weekly basis, he stood up to the test, and hense the problem left the club. He also had experinced players unavailable for most of the year, and he still captained the side competetvly till the last round. Keep in mind sth.barwon passed them 9 down in the first dig. Well done mate.


What happened to the saying 'Well all be true to the old maroon and blue'.

 

[supersaintjohnny]

Re: Div 1 Relegation???

crkyluva,

I agree with a post you put up earlier that i hadnt read. All div 1 & 2 should be turf, the 3rd divison should be hard wicket and a place for clubs to build themselves up to play in higher divisions.

I'll take you back a few years when newcomb and bell park were the stand alone turf teams in div 3. They played all home games, the gca backed the clubs because they had a vision to play div 1 cricket. Newcomb got there bell park droped off a little bit. The system worked well then, then the gca changed it and its now is the joke that it is.
I hear St.Albans will be comming into the comp, i just hope that they are made to do there penance in div 3. Guild would be pretty pissed if they went into div2. Anyway my point is they had it write back then it was purely a club championship system, if you win that it proves that your club as a whole on the field is strong. You need your best teams in the top divisions, that will make div 2 stronger again. As it stands due to the constant changes, division one ist what it used to be, it's highly overated.

Obviously another jealous Newcomb bloke. What's the matter mate just cos your club cant hold onto any of it's players and is on the way down. No disrespect to Ando cos he is doin a great job but the committee should get its head out of the sand. They are to quick to hang it on St Albans for doing everything right and moving forward in leaps and bounds. Maybe our committee would let your committee sit in on one of our meetings you might finally learn how to run a cricket club.

 

[a for effort]

Re: Div 1 Relegation???

I've read here that Newcomb & District have asked to be relagated. If this is true there will be 2 brothers that will never play at the club again.

For the select few people that have worked there arses off to get the club there, then to just give it up without a fight is a total joke.

The leaders of the club need to have questions asked of them if this is true. I can tell you as an insider that the club has alot of young tallent, but yes it does drop off as you go down the grades.
Butt to ask to be relagated is just not on. With negativity like this around the club it has no hope of getting better.

Just one other this S.Anderson did a fantastic job leading the club. With the crap he put up with from certain people on a weekly basis, he stood up to the test, and hense the problem left the club. He also had experinced players unavailable for most of the year, and he still captained the side competetvly till the last round. Keep in mind sth.barwon passed them 9 down in the first dig. Well done mate.


What happened to the saying 'Well all be true to the old maroon and blue'.

According to S.Anderson it was just a rumour and there's no truth to it. Unfortunately for Newcomb, relegation seems fairly likely regardless.

 

[SHANEBOURNEorWARNE]

Re: Div 1 Relegation???

crkyluva,

I agree with a post you put up earlier that i hadnt read. All div 1 & 2 should be turf, the 3rd divison should be hard wicket and a place for clubs to build themselves up to play in higher divisions.

I'll take you back a few years when newcomb and bell park were the stand alone turf teams in div 3. They played all home games, the gca backed the clubs because they had a vision to play div 1 cricket. Newcomb got there bell park droped off a little bit. The system worked well then, then the gca changed it and its now is the joke that it is.
I hear St.Albans will be comming into the comp, i just hope that they are made to do there penance in div 3. Guild would be pretty pissed if they went into div2. Anyway my point is they had it write back then it was purely a club championship system, if you win that it proves that your club as a whole on the field is strong. You need your best teams in the top divisions, that will make div 2 stronger again. As it stands due to the constant changes, division one ist what it used to be, it's highly overated.

I see a contradiction happening here, you want GCA2 to be all turf and GCA3 hard wicket but your saying we should have to do our 'Penance' in div3 first what do you want us to do pull up the turf wicket till we've qualified

And then you say the club championship should be what decides who goes where- which NDCC finished last in and you want them to fight to stay up???

I've read here that Newcomb & District have asked to be relagated. If this is true there will be 2 brothers that will never play at the club again.

For the select few people that have worked there arses off to get the club there, then to just give it up without a fight is a total joke.

The leaders of the club need to have questions asked of them if this is true. I can tell you as an insider that the club has alot of young tallent, but yes it does drop off as you go down the grades.
Butt to ask to be relagated is just not on. With negativity like this around the club it has no hope of getting better.

Just one other this S.Anderson did a fantastic job leading the club. With the crap he put up with from certain people on a weekly basis, he stood up to the test, and hense the problem left the club. He also had experinced players unavailable for most of the year, and he still captained the side competetvly till the last round. Keep in mind sth.barwon passed them 9 down in the first dig. Well done mate.


What happened to the saying 'Well all be true to the old maroon and blue'.

And you also had three teams lose outright last round including your 1sts.

 

[THE_LATE_MAIL]

Re: Div 1 Relegation???

Why so much talk on this subject? Its as good as done. Ndcc gone thomson in. As for div 3 wrap it up. Let the turf clubs back into div 2. Hard wickets join the bpca. Just have the 3 soild comps.

 

[crktluva]

Re: Div 1 Relegation???

Why so much talk on this subject? Its as good as done. Ndcc gone thomson in. As for div 3 wrap it up. Let the turf clubs back into div 2. Hard wickets join the bpca. Just have the 3 soild comps.

95% agree with ya there late mail, except some div 3 teams would still get pumped in BPCA. try this idea. 4 divisions, all turf in div 1 and 2, 3 and 4 hard wicket, problem solved. promotion and relegation by club championship points which nobody can ever argue about. st albans are definitely better than div 3 by the way, and once they play div 2 they will get better with experience against stronger clubs.

 

[Renny24]

Re: Div 1 Relegation???

Just love it how newcomb allways is in the mix. The donkies that run the gca will want them out no doubt this is the opportunaty they have been looking for. what about GCA SORRY GEELONG CITY oh sorry and i hope AGG GETS wind of this because while he has a say city could fold and hed still have them in divi one. THOMSON may well come up for the season realy good div 2 side but will struggle. If your a side on the border you will always be a target.
GCA have no idea you watch they will change the structure again. Im hearing 2 divisons and hard wicket clubs can head back to the sticks and sort themselves out as the souther liegh mo again.

Get the chip off your shoulder; it's not a matter of wanting Newcomb out or not. If they are on the bottom of the club assessment, they get relegated; it not they stay in. They have been near the bottom for the past couple of seasons and despite the efforts of some, their on-field results haven't helped matters. If it was Geelong City in the same position, i'm sure the same thing would happen. Personally i think it will be awhile before City or Newtown goes but there is such a good cross-section of clubs represented on the committee now that the time for pulling swifties has come and gone.

 

[cow-corner]

Re: Div 1 Relegation???

i guess this is a pretty pointless fact but the dinos used 6 kids in the 2nds under the age of 17 including a 13year old, and 4 played 6+ games
i thought i would just point that out

 

[ants14]

Re: Div 1 Relegation???

i guess this is a pretty pointless fact but the dinos used 6 kids in the 2nds under the age of 17 including a 13year old, and 4 played 6+ games
i thought i would just point that out

North had a 15 year old play 8 games in the 1s and 5 games in the 2s
A 17 year old played 10 games in the 1s
Last year a 16 year old played 10 games in the 1s
L.Szponar(18), B.Szponar(18), Davis(17), McGlinchey(15), Kingwell(17), Winter(15 or 16), Mellington(18)(apologies if smidge is 18 now)
All these blokes have played turf this year for our club, our 2s made the finals and our firsts finished 7th.
My point is, you can;t blame juniors for failing, if they're any good, you will still get results. IMO Newcomb's problem is too many people play for themself instead of for the team, which is something we don;t stand for at North. That;s almost exactly what Jurassic Park has been saying. He's not making excuses hes just trying to fix it.