Help With Dropping Bowling Arm? Yasir Shah...

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TomBowler97

TomBowler97

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Hi Guys,

Did some bowling on the driveway yesterday, only bowling from crease position where I practiced dropping my bowling arm so that I wasn't bowling and trying to spin the ball from near my ears, I practiced and also videoed, when it came to the video, I saw my arms was at no different height. I wondered if any of you knew what could help me be able to drop the bowling arm, would dropping my left/front shoulder help? Any help is appreciated.

Also I love the coverage of Pakistan v England, I can see Yasir Shah has a relatively high arm and a very different action, I know his works for him but I can see he also bowls some very inconsistent deliveries, eg a pitched up leg spinner and then the next ball a drag down. There has also been some good split screen comparisons showing him and Rashid, their crease positions are nearly identical, however, when Yasir bowls, his front foot turns sharply to allow the pivot to occur and the energy to explode, however, Rashid stays still, meaning less energy and allowance to pivot. It is nice to be able to watch to World Class Leg Spinners regularly, without having to search them up on YouTube.

Yasir Shah v Me Comp. https://gyazo.com/1ccc540a0d5a71d05ae275a8eadabf56

What do you think? I see that I am more upright, what would this mean?
 
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TomBowler97 said:
Hi Guys,

Did some bowling on the driveway yesterday, only bowling from crease position where I practiced dropping my bowling arm so that I wasn't bowling and trying to spin the ball from near my ears, I practiced and also videoed, when it came to the video, I saw my arms was at no different height. I wondered if any of you knew what could help me be able to drop the bowling arm, would dropping my left/front shoulder help? Any help is appreciated.

Also I love the coverage of Pakistan v England, I can see Yasir Shah has a relatively high arm and a very different action, I know his works for him but I can see he also bowls some very inconsistent deliveries, eg a pitched up leg spinner and then the next ball a drag down. There has also been some good split screen comparisons showing him and Rashid, their crease positions are nearly identical, however, when Yasir bowls, his front foot turns sharply to allow the pivot to occur and the energy to explode, however, Rashid stays still, meaning less energy and allowance to pivot. It is nice to be able to watch to World Class Leg Spinners regularly, without having to search them up on YouTube.

Yasir Shah v Me Comp. https://gyazo.com/1ccc540a0d5a71d05ae275a8eadabf56

What do you think? I see that I am more upright, what would this mean?
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Tom, just massively exaggerate it, don't try and do it a bit. Try and change it massively, you'll probably end up doing it at a reasonable angle.
 
TomBowler97 said:
Will do Dave. I'll have another go on Sunday, I'll drop the shoulder lower and that should help my arm!
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Leave the shoulder, just bring the arm down a lot, it'll feel as weird as hell, but it makes a massive difference. I do it sometimes and it works exceptionally well, it's one of the things I do every now and then as a variation, but I recognise that if I practiced it, it's potentially going to offer a lot. I just haven't had the time to focus on it and make a decision about it and I'm happy with my upright arm as I like the top-spinner potential it offers.
 
I have got use to the high arm now, but I just feel it offers me probably 2/3 good pitches balls, with the others dragged short or too full so I feel that it time for an adaption, however it does offer a good top spinner, and my googly always pitches well and spins without the batsman picking it, I may bowl leggies with my lower arm, and my googly with the high arm, because I only bowl a googly probably 1 every 3 overs, so the batsman, especially at our level with not be focusing on the angle of the arm. So that is also an option.
 
someblokecalleddave said:
Tom, just massively exaggerate it, don't try and do it a bit. Try and change it massively, you'll probably end up doing it at a reasonable angle.
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Dave has got it exactly right here mate, you just need to feel like you're almost bowling a malinga style delivery your arm is so horizontal then when you watch the film back you'll be surprised how much higher it still was than you thought it could possibly be. Try going for a feeling of your bowling hand just being further away from your body, thats what I do. Almost level with your shoulder, it'll feel weird and like its very low, but when you deliver the ball i guarantee it will still actually be above the height of your shoulders.
 
TomBowler97 said:
I have got use to the high arm now, but I just feel it offers me probably 2/3 good pitches balls, with the others dragged short or too full so I feel that it time for an adaption, however it does offer a good top spinner, and my googly always pitches well and spins without the batsman picking it, I may bowl leggies with my lower arm, and my googly with the high arm, because I only bowl a googly probably 1 every 3 overs, so the batsman, especially at our level with not be focusing on the angle of the arm. So that is also an option.
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I would not advocate different arm heights with your different deliveries, you'll find the wrong un is actually quite easy to delivery from a rounder arm and you'll get it to spin more in fact. When you want to bowl a googly just drop that left shoulder a little and bob's your uncle. It will turn square mate, promise!
 
GoldenArm said:
I would not advocate different arm heights with your different deliveries, you'll find the wrong un is actually quite easy to delivery from a rounder arm and you'll get it to spin more in fact. When you want to bowl a googly just drop that left shoulder a little and bob's your uncle. It will turn square mate, promise!
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Thanks for the help guys I appreicate it! I will give it a go when I go to nets and video it!
 
Tom, what are your main aims and objectives tomorrow, because you seem to be over-loading yourself with different things when you've possibly not resolved some of the fundamentals yet?
 
someblokecalleddave said:
Tom, what are your main aims and objectives tomorrow, because you seem to be over-loading yourself with different things when you've possibly not resolved some of the fundamentals yet?
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Find an action that works for me, without consistent drag downs or full tosses, like I said earlier I bowl 2/3 good balls the rest are drag downs or full tosses, hopefully lowering the arm will help me find a good line and length more frequently.
 
TomBowler97 said:
Find an action that works for me, without consistent drag downs or full tosses, like I said earlier I bowl 2/3 good balls the rest are drag downs or full tosses, hopefully lowering the arm will help me find a good line and length more frequently.
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Is your run up consistent - the same every time, or are you still undecided?
 
someblokecalleddave said:
Is your run up consistent - the same every time, or are you still undecided?
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I am pretty sure my run up is solid now, It is more of what happens at the crease which is the problem. However I am sometimes stop starty with my run up, taking off on a different foot sometimes, which must stop. Like MacGill, says you need repitition, repitition, repitition.
 
TomBowler97 said:
I am pretty sure my run up is solid now, It is more of what happens at the crease which is the problem. However I am sometimes stop starty with my run up, taking off on a different foot sometimes, which must stop. Like MacGill, says you need repitition, repitition, repitition.
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One of the things I noticed last night which I think is fundamentally wrong with your whole bowling action and I've never seen a single wrist spinner do - is the Monty Panesar Finger spinner abrupt stop and get ready to catch thing. Which as far as I can make out is one more thing you have to worry about and completely screws up the fade away in your follow through.
In this video here you jump at the end into that position which strikes me as being totally wrong?

I would definitely sort the run up out first and foremost. Make a decision about whether you want to be one of those long run types or a short run-up type. I'm of the opinion that if you're stuttering in the run up, you're going to be doing that in match situations in the future. If you don't get that sorted at the start, you're going to be making adjustments all the time - it's the very basis of every thing else you have to do. You have to have a solid foundation on which to build and construct the rest of the bowling action, as you've said yourself above it has to be repeatable and consistent. A lot of what we have to do includes looking back at what we do and figuring out what's going wrong, so think of it as being a building. If you get the foundations wrong all of the subsequent construction will be under-mined by the weak foundations and you'll eventually have to pull the walls back down to rectify the weak foundations. I honestly wouldn't worry about any aspect of your bowling until you're 99.99% sure you've nailed the run-up first. Length of run-up, what foot you start off from and whether you come in at an angle and how you follow through and fade away out of the run-up.
 
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TomBowler97 said:
Find an action that works for me, without consistent drag downs or full tosses, like I said earlier I bowl 2/3 good balls the rest are drag downs or full tosses, hopefully lowering the arm will help me find a good line and length more frequently.
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I see this problem time and again with the spin bowlers I coach.

Obtaining a consistent line and length is a matter of having a consistent, locked-in action. Bowl 6 balls in exactly the same way and they will land in exactly the same place.

The ONLY way to obtain a consistent, locked-in action is to stick with one action and practice over and over and over again with that action. Every time you fiddle with your action, you go back to square one.

Some people go their entire lives constantly fiddling with their action and never manage to obtain that single, consistent action. The result is an entire career of full-tosses and drag-downs. As tempting as it may be to constantly try and fiddle with your action, RESIST!
 
SLA said:
Some people go their entire lives constantly fiddling with their action and never manage to obtain that single, consistent action. As tempting as it may be to constantly try and fiddle with your action, RESIST!
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That's almost a description of me! I got rid of the full tosses and drag downs description as they were not a feature. But as SLA says find the action that you're happy with and stick with it.
 
someblokecalleddave said:
That's almost a description of me! I got rid of the full tosses and drag downs description as they were not a feature. But as SLA says find the action that you're happy with and stick with it.
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I completely get the concept of sticking with an action then practise practise practise till its consistent. But surely you've got to play around a little bit to find that action in the first place? Over thinking can be a bad thing but there's got to be some positive thought process going on just making a couple of little adjustments that produce a positive result and then sticking with the changes provided they were good ones? The fastest progress I have made is when i started using a proper bowling coach, then you've got someone to bounce ideas off or just tell you to forget about something because its not helpful. Can be expensive but as a junior it should be a bit easier? Get the parents to fork out! haha.
 
GoldenArm said:
I completely get the concept of sticking with an action then practise practise practise till its consistent. But surely you've got to play around a little bit to find that action in the first place? Over thinking can be a bad thing but there's got to be some positive thought process going on just making a couple of little adjustments that produce a positive result and then sticking with the changes provided they were good ones? The fastest progress I have made is when i started using a proper bowling coach, then you've got someone to bounce ideas off or just tell you to forget about something because its not helpful. Can be expensive but as a junior it should be a bit easier? Get the parents to fork out! haha.
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Of course when you are first learning it may take you a few years of fiddling to settle on an action that works for you. Most juniors should have their actions pretty much set by the time they hit their teens. There may be a bit of recalibration to do whenever they have a growth spurt but that's just maintenance.

The majority of a spinner's career they should be thinking about variations, field placings, strategy, reading batsmen's weaknesses, mental strength and resilience, not obsessing over the fundamentals of their action, and of course just enjoying their bowling!
 
GoldenArm said:
I completely get the concept of sticking with an action then practise practise practise till its consistent. But surely you've got to play around a little bit to find that action in the first place? Over thinking can be a bad thing but there's got to be some positive thought process going on just making a couple of little adjustments that produce a positive result and then sticking with the changes provided they were good ones? The fastest progress I have made is when i started using a proper bowling coach, then you've got someone to bounce ideas off or just tell you to forget about something because its not helpful. Can be expensive but as a junior it should be a bit easier? Get the parents to fork out! haha.
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Yeah I reckon you have to go through some pain in order to gain, or as you say, someone actually coaches you and sets you off in the right direction, otherwise as we all know it is trial and error for years. I think though the focus during your early years should be as much about your run-up and action through the crease as much if not more than what's happening with the arms, hand and fingers.
 
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