Jumping off the Wrong Foot

[Boris]

Re: Jumping off the Wrong Foot

I have a full time job now, on the second year of an electrician's apprentiship, my plan was to save up money doing a trade (not sure about in England, but over here they are all high paying) and then still see if I wanted to go to uni after that after going very well at school in the first place. That want is greater than ever now, sport's psychology really interesting me and places like this forum have only further increased this. Never went for 'actual' p) sciences like biology, though, but wouldn't mind getting to the same level of coaching, for want of a better term, as you, but my qualifications fail me.

I am planning on going for a certificate in cricket coaching, perhaps that's a good idea while I'm having this time off from physical activity.

Anyway, to get back onto topic, I will be speaking to Sam tomorrow, so waiting until then.

 

[Liz Ward]

Re: Jumping off the Wrong Foot

...but wouldn't mind getting to the same level of coaching, for want of a better term, as you, but my qualifications fail me.

If you can imagine it, you can do it. Don't let the past hold you back, your future is a lot longer and a lot greater!

Working your way up the coaching ladder is a great idea, it sounds like there are far fewer good coaches than electricians where you are. Anyway, finish your apprenticeship and you will always have something to fall back on .

 

[mas cambios]

Re: Jumping off the Wrong Foot

I am planning on going for a certificate in cricket coaching, perhaps that's a good idea while I'm having this time off from physical activity.

I would go for it, if you can get it sorted it. It will help your own game as much as anything else and give you an insight into what coaches are trying to achieve. Plus it can take you in some interested directions!

I've had training/fault finding/coaching sessions with ex-internationals, fitness work with the guy who trains the nearest county to me and had behind the scene tours of various county grounds.

Currently I'm coaching a junior county age group and it's very interesting - would never of done any of the above if I hadn't gone out and obtained my level 1 badge a few years ago. Well on the way to getting level 3 at the moment and I said above it really does help your own game, not just technique wise but in terms of tactics, mental and fitness.

 

[Boris]

Re: Jumping off the Wrong Foot

Things are a little different in Australia, but I will definitely give it a go. The major difference is size, the greatest population of cricket players is the equivalent distance from where I live as you flying from England to the very south east of Europe, if not the middle east. It's at least a three hour drive if I want to attempt to be a coach on my own, so I would be doing it out of my own goodwill to my club during the same training times as I am meant to be training.

Do you see many young coaches around?

Thank you very much for this.

Following soon will be an actual on topic post

 

[Liz Ward]

Re: Jumping off the Wrong Foot

Do you see many young coaches around?

Over here, you can take your L1 (coaches assistant) at 16 and L2 (coach) at 18. I know many 18/19/20 year olds working as coaches with children, 6-16 year olds. However, I work with adults and most, in this area, are 'elderly' [in comparison], like me.

 

[mas cambios]

Re: Jumping off the Wrong Foot

Do you see many young coaches around?

You see a few. As Liz has pointed out above, a lot of them tend to work with the younger ages (for various reasons) but it's all experience.

We try to get the keen young players to take a Young Leaders Award, then complete their L1 at 16-18. With this they can then help out with the youngest age groups.

 

[Boris]

Re: Jumping off the Wrong Foot

I have done many leadership courses, especially as a result of school. That's one of the main reasons, as well as my old man, that I was given the captaincy of the C Grade team, usually reserved for veterans of the club, at the age of 17, so I have a reputation amongst the club so people should listen to me as a coach at all ages. Unfortunately I'm at a different club now, but I can't see myself staying here for long.

As I said, on topic post coming when I can get the information finalised.

 

[Kram81]

Re: Jumping off the Wrong Foot

I've always bowled like this, probably not the best advertisement ..

 

[Liz Ward]

Re: Jumping off the Wrong Foot

I take it you mean off the wrong foot. It may work for you. It is not ideal but that does not make it a total no, no.

There are other things in an action that make a difference. Just because an action is unorthodox, does not mean it should be discouraged. Only if it is unsafe, should you look to change it.

There are many reasons why an action is unorthodox and it could be due to genetics etc.

I once knew an awsome, young, spin bowler, he could spin any which way with great success. Hat tricks were not uncommon. However, the coach had no idea how he did it and did not understand his action... didn't stop him trying to change it though. Although the bowler would not have anything to do with the changes, he has never bowled spin since.

If you have always bowled off the wrong foot with no discomfort, I am sure it will be fine, you could possibly increase pace if you get it right but there are no guarantees. Again, it is dependent on other factors.

 

[Kram81]

Re: Jumping off the Wrong Foot

I think I can easily get away with only because a) I bowl off a very short run b) only very medium pace c) usually only 2 or 3 overs a game at the most.

If you were a genuine fast bowler I reckon it would surely put a lot of extra strain on the body?

The funny thing is I never even knew until that fella put up the video of his son. Thinking about I'm pretty sure one of my mates does it as well, he is actually a good bowler but still only mediumish pace.

 

[Liz Ward]

Re: Jumping off the Wrong Foot

If either you or your mate would like to put up a video, we could have a look and see if it would have made a difference to pace.

 

[phil2oo8]

Re: Jumping off the Wrong Foot

Liz is right, i had to change from bowling this way, it was really wrecking my back and i still think the strain of bowling that way is what's caused my dodgy groin. I changed it by just bowling off one step and forcing it to be one step, that way i got an action that didn't allow for the double stutter on the right foot and then as i added the run up it felt wrong with the double stutter of my right leg so it sort of blended out.

 

[Kram81]

Re: Jumping off the Wrong Foot

If either you or your mate would like to put up a video, we could have a look and see if it would have made a difference to pace.

Haha, doesn't really matter these days I just play indoor and we occasionally dust off the gear and go down to the nets for fun, haven't played a proper game for at least 3 years.

I reckon it's ok for at least my body because I almost have never get even slightly sore from bowling with a minimal warm up, when playing Aussie Rules suffered from chronic soreness after games, made me give it up when I had to work in a trade during the week. Strangely, I've practically had zero actual injuries playing any sport compared to most people...

 

[Kram81]

Re: Jumping off the Wrong Foot

If either you or your mate would like to put up a video, we could have a look and see if it would have made a difference to pace.

Haha, doesn't really matter these days I just play indoor and we occasionally dust off the gear and go down to the nets for fun, haven't played a proper game for about 3 years.

I reckon it's ok for at least my body because I almost never get even slightly sore from bowling with a minimal warm up, when playing Aussie Rules suffered from chronic soreness after games, made me give it up when I had to work in a trade during the week. Strangely, I've practically had zero actual injuries playing any sport compared to most people...

 

[Boris]

Re: Jumping off the Wrong Foot

He has officially decided to change his action, as it is causing him too much trouble. He isn't willing to put up a video though, so bad luck there. He also has ordered me to have him fixed by September ... apparently I have been enslaved to give feedback.

He so far has walked through it many times and slowly, just bowling from a 3/4 length off a two step run up and after 3 days at that he has progressed nicely, now bowling alright from a half length run up at a very slow jog. He has to concentrate hard to land his feet in the right order.

This technique seems to be working. Is there anything that should be added or changed? Will just slowing everything down produce near the same quality bowling (from 'old' action) by start of season in September?

Now he has found a little issue with his 'new' bowling action. I will describe as best I can:
As he comes into bowl he is having some trouble leaning too far to the off side. He is looking like falling over to his left to make his right arm come through straight up and down. Problem?
His right arm is coming through much better now, smoothly and not like the whipping action of the past, but his wrist is a little loose and looks as if it is flopping around. Haven't told him about that yet, but will do.
He also has a front on action where his left foot, never comes close to crossing that of the line down the pitch as drawn by the right foot, but pointing forward towards the batsman. Is it a problem to have both feet facing forward and him bowling very front on like that?
Also his follow through still stops dead, and every time I tell him to follow through for a longer distance and let himself 'ooze' out of the delivery he doesn't change at all, just seems like he can't concentrate on doing that. Any drills or similar to enforce good technique with a follow through? (Cattle prod maybe? )

He has been sending me videos, as he does live a nine hour drive away, but has a firm stance about me not uploading them. Hopefully my descriptions do them justice.

All in all it looks much more pleasing to the eye, although it is only at the slow speeds.

 

[Liz Ward]

Re: Jumping off the Wrong Foot

I don't know about cattle prods... should work... the whip is quite effective though .

You need to take Sam back more; he has moved on too fast. Two/three steps, bowl (keeping straight) and walk six steps. He needs to get that message rerouted on the neuromuscular pathway; both the straightness and the six steps. Until he can get this on auto, there is no point in moving on.

Firstly, he does need to keep his feet straight. I would like him to become a well oiled locomotive rather than a runaway truck so think about tramlines all the way down.

The lean to the left is not good. Ask him to stand straight and raise his right arm out (straight) to the right and up. How far can he get without moving the torso?

 

[Boris]

Re: Jumping off the Wrong Foot

Ok, sounds like a plan.

He has said he has been feeling good with it and has hurried through everything. Accuracy is quite shocking.

I thought the lean would be a problem. He tells me that he can correct it, but it doesn't feel natural, like he is forcing himself too. He can get his back pretty well straight with the arm straight up and down as well. Good sign I suppose?

Will tell him that.

Suppose it's much better for you to pretty much have a clean slate to work with, someone that wants a new action altogther. That way there are no mistakes to correct, only mistakes to prevent.

 

[Liz Ward]

Re: Jumping off the Wrong Foot

Accuracy is going to fail initially. Taking the action right down should work on this.

Correcting his action is going to feel strange for a while; his body is so used to doing the old action automatically. He needs to engage the brain until his central nervous system gets the message... then the new action will be automatic but he needs to run through it over and over again. So... yes, I guess he is forcing himself .

The fact that he can get his arm straight up with a straight back is great. Some people lean due to impingement (which is what I was looking for). If that was the case, it would need sorting first.

Sam's case is not all bad. At least he does not have a mixed action; they're much trickier!

 

[Boris]

Re: Jumping off the Wrong Foot

He was down at the nets by himself today so he tells me, and I think he may be over correcting the leaning problem, he says it would be hurting if he did it full speed. Perhaps he is only 'capable', if that's the right word, at a slow speed as he is doing?

I am quite familiar with skill acquisition and those stages of development so I have been relaying what I know about that in layman's terms as well.

He thinks I am a genius at this point, haven't told him yet that almost all I have told him is coming not from myself . I will make sure you get the credit though

 

[Liz Ward]

Re: Jumping off the Wrong Foot

...He thinks I am a genius at this point, haven't told him yet that almost all I have told him is coming not from myself . I will make sure you get the credit though

No need to disillusion him... all young guys need a hero to worship .

Because he has been bowling the way he has for some years, I am afraid Sam will have quite considerable muscle imbalances in his back. Working slowly [with correct mechanics] will go some way to correcting this [if he gives it time] but he could help himself by working the upper body and back with resistance. Remember, he is only young, so light weights to start with.

If he does overcompensate, he will feel very sore but it is very hard to lean the other way... it might just feel as though he is over correcting. Check the videos very carefully.

I wanted to show you a video of a trebuchet so that you could pass it on to Sam and ask him to watch how the arm comes over without any deviation left or right. Front on bowlers need to adhere to this [stance] far more than side on bowlers, but I found this and couldn't resist....

YouTube - Rich English Guy and his Trebuchet

...don't laugh at us; we are extremely proud of our excentricity