Video Analysis Of Leg Spin Bowling..... Advise/ Suggestion Welcome!!!

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highesteem1 said:
@shrek: sorry for being late to respond due to different time zone... allready answered by Dave in crisp... really slow site, and moreover u can not locate who are the members from cricketing or related fraternity..
ONE SUGGESTION for Adminitrator
  • Is it possible to categorise members here in different sub category like coach (Batting/ Bowling)/ fielding/ fitness), professional player, batsman, pacer, biomechanic expert,nutritionist, Enthusiast etc..
  • It will be good if we add video analyser (like Quintic, Kinovea, skill spector) for online analysis by the expert
Just a suggestion for consideration
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I think that's a good idea, but you have to realise that it is only the spinning section on this site that has traffic in the way that you see here and are interacting with. That's primarily down to a handful of people that get on here on a regular basis and spend the time to respond to the people that ask the questions. If you look elsewhere you'll find forums on different cricket websites that have far more members, but they are usually inactive, full of kids slagging each other off or are just really painful to navigate round. There is section on this site for feedback, so you could comment there........... http://www.bigcricket.com/community/forums/feedback-notices.4/
 
highesteem1 said:
Many Thanx to all for sincere Review.....
I am UPLOADING another Latest one (recorded today only) for further comments...
http://youtu.be/kXwAqhjKQvE
Hey Liz I need ur help here... we discussed a lot in Silicon Live...
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There is not really much more I can say.

Good correction of bfc, although ffc is still not quite where I would like to see it.

The nba is still high, as is the bowling arm... are the occasional top spin/googly intentional?

The same with the off spinner's bottom half...
...basically, I am not too sure if the bowler has had enough time to work out what he wants from his action. Until then, I would be extremely reluctant to change anything. I am very much adverse to over engineering spin bowlers. This player needs to gain a natural, thought out action before we can really say if any changes needed to be made.
 
Liz Ward said:
There is not really much more I can say.

Good correction of bfc, although ffc is still not quite where I would like to see it.

The nba is still high, as is the bowling arm... are the occasional top spin/googly intentional?

The same with the off spinner's bottom half...
...basically, I am not too sure if the bowler has had enough time to work out what he wants from his action. Until then, I would be extremely reluctant to change anything. I am very much adverse to over engineering spin bowlers. This player needs to gain a natural, thought out action before we can really say if any changes needed to be made.
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@Liz thanx​
yes he can do top spin & Googly quite comfortably​
can u explain in details ur observation about "off spinner's bottom half..." I am not clear!!!!​
I feel raised non B Arm is required to keep shoulder close & resist head drop side wise whats ur opinion??​
what is ur suggestion for front foot correction??​
 
shrek said:
Perhaps I'm not as competent as some of the others here to comment on this - but his left arm seems a bit weak to me. He tucks it in well, but to add pace when he bowls, perhaps he can have a stronger arm leading into the delivery.
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I think that was my comment on highesteems youtube video, the arm doesn't reach out hard and strong as Beau Casson suggests. High Esteem have a look at the Beau Casson video and the point I'm suggesting.

Have a look at this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OhnPiWob0QI&feature=related 1.37 seconds in. Interesting that Casson doesn't do as Shrek has been suggesting in one of the other threads regarding the tucking in of the leading arm.
 
There is very little wrong with this action... other than consistency... however, that will come with practise.

Great improvements in bfc, although once it went back to the old ways ;).
ffc still a little closed; this is inhibiting pace.
No worries about the non-bowling arm, with your action this will eliminate the unwanted top spin and delivery to fine leg position.
Lower half still looks a bit of an off spinner's but I would need a back view to be sure and to be able to ascertain whether maximum spin is being imparted.
Bowling shoulder still needs working on; it needs to lead more.
Love the knee flexion at ffc; don't let anybody persuade you to brace that knee!
Great improvements in using the shoulder stabilisers; this will protect you from RC issues as you get older and also provide more power.
 
someblokecalleddave said:
I think that was my comment on highesteems youtube video, the arm doesn't reach out hard and strong as Beau Casson suggests. High Esteem have a look at the Beau Casson video and the point I'm suggesting.

Have a look at this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OhnPiWob0QI&feature=related 1.37 seconds in. Interesting that Casson doesn't do as Shrek has been suggesting in one of the other threads regarding the tucking in of the leading arm.
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On the contrary dave, he does tuck in his elbow very nicely. If you notice, his leading arm goes to the inside of the right leg that ensures a tuck. He then follows through and rotates around the right foot so that the arm goes behind.
As I was not tucking in my elbow properly, to ensure that I do, I did not finish my follow through and left the hand at the point shown in 2:26 - tucked in, ending up on the inside of the leading thigh
 
I don't tend to look at these videos... for many reasons... but as I was not sure what Dave and Shrek were referencing, I had a look... still not sure :(.

However, strange how the narrator went on long and boringly about the things Casson does better than the bowler and does not mention the things the bowler does better than Casson... there are quite a few!

I have rarely seen a 'coach' demonstrate perfect technique or a player display it, and even rarely so in spin. If you watch lots of videos, you will get lots of different actions and lots of different advice.

HE1, you have talent so I will give you and your Dad the best advice you will ever get. If you want to be the best, you need to pay for the best coach to take you there. Don't wreck your future by treating this like a sweet shop. Good technique is not about pic n' mix. You cannot take what you like from one bowler and something else from another when it suits you. Dr Frankenstein did this and he ended up with a monster... do you want to be a monster? A hybrid with a lot of different parts but little of any use?

The beauty of spin is that it works for your individual physiology. Not everybody can bowl spin and most spin bowlers cannot bowl pace. If God has given you the raw materials to make it in spin, make the most of it. You need a coach who can watch you and work with your own quirky action. Don't try to be another somebody else, strive to be the best you that you can and maybe, in the future, we may be watching you at one of the test matches :D.

Remember, what works for one, does not work for everybody!!
 
Hi Dave
I am not too convinced about Hard & strong non bowling arm for these age group of spinners.. it leads to early opening up of bowling shoulder as muscles are yet to be strong enough at 10 yrs of age. regarding tucking I am not able to understand what Shrek wants to say.... may be my ignorance !!! @shrek can u describe with a snap shot of action please !!
I am absolutely convinced about what Liz said every individual is unique in nature .... Yah I understand what u said about sweet shop mix... thats why I always post my ones to understand different comments on my videos rather than comparision with other videos.
Liz can u explain what is the diff between lower half of Off Vs Leg spinner? ( I have asked u in past also...:)
One thing I notice that energy level (late thrust while delivering the ball) is lacking...I mean finishing the ball with definite purpose of taking wicket or restraining the batsman to score. As if " My duty is to bowl let the the batsman do as he wish to".....
 
highesteem1 said:
Hi Dave
I am not too convinced about Hard & strong non bowling arm for these age group of spinners.. it leads to early opening up of bowling shoulder as muscles are yet to be strong enough at 10 yrs of age. regarding tucking I am not able to understand what Shrek wants to say.... may be my ignorance !!! @shrek can u describe with a snap shot of action please !!
I am absolutely convinced about what Liz said every individual is unique in nature .... Yah I understand what u said about sweet shop mix... thats why I always post my ones to understand different comments on my videos rather than comparision with other videos.
Liz can u explain what is the diff between lower half of Off Vs Leg spinner? ( I have asked u in past also...:)
One thing I notice that energy level (late thrust while delivering the ball) is lacking...I mean finishing the ball with definite purpose of taking wicket or restraining the batsman to score. As if " My duty is to bowl let the the batsman do as he wish to".....
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I think I've said it before I'm no expert and if Liz is chipping in with comments I'll just back off as she knows what she's on about. I'm kind of in charge of the Leg Spinners at my club, but I do very little other than to encourage them and keep them from spending time trying to learn all the variations and just trying to get them focusing on their leg breaks and spinning the ball. The only thing I ever really suggest on a consistent basis is that if they lose their leg break and they get less spin to try the stand start drill and it usually gets them back on track. If they're getting the ball to turn I ignore all their idiosyncrasies, because if you go trying to change the way they bowl it tends to make things worse I find. But if people ask questions on here, I answer on the basis of what I've seen suggested elsewhere and have tried myself and may have found that it works.
 
I've experienced it with my own son Joe, some days he spins it so much he'll pitch it wide of leg and bowl the other kids round the back of their legs. The next week he wont be able to do anything with a ball spin-wise, but then if I intervene it turns into a pretty negative situation most of the time with no positive outcome and it turns him off of wanting to bowl spin. At the minute he's bowling seam up and doing well, so I'll let him go with that rather than insist that he spins the ball, the choice to spin ultimately is his and if he sees it and experiences it all around him he knows that he can do it and might come back to it when he feels it's more fun than seam bowling. It's a difficult situation and I just have to ride the lows and highs and allow him to make his own decisions.
 
highesteem1 said:
Hi Dave
I am not too convinced about Hard & strong non bowling arm for these age group of spinners.. it leads to early opening up of bowling shoulder as muscles are yet to be strong enough at 10 yrs of age. regarding tucking I am not able to understand what Shrek wants to say.... may be my ignorance !!! @shrek can u describe with a snap shot of action please !!
I am absolutely convinced about what Liz said every individual is unique in nature .... Yah I understand what u said about sweet shop mix... thats why I always post my ones to understand different comments on my videos rather than comparision with other videos.
Liz can u explain what is the diff between lower half of Off Vs Leg spinner? ( I have asked u in past also...:)
One thing I notice that energy level (late thrust while delivering the ball) is lacking...I mean finishing the ball with definite purpose of taking wicket or restraining the batsman to score. As if " My duty is to bowl let the the batsman do as he wish to".....
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Highesteem- The kid in your videos has most of the action including the elbow tuck properly sussed out so you don't have to worry about it.

It was for people like me who gave up bowling for a while and then had to come back to it- We haven't yet got to the point where our entire action is mechanical and repeatable. So, small changes keep coming in - especially under pressure in a match situation. Sometimes, the arm may drop lower, sometimes it may go past vertical, sometimes we release way too late - all these result in head high full tosses interspersed with short pitch balls that bounce twice (almost) before reaching the batsmen. My friend (vc of our team) suggested that - if I tuck in my left elbow after I bowl, the release point won't vary as much, because I have one constant in my action to base the entire action around. It seemed to work for me which is why I pointed out in the other thread. But it is not relevant here - as you have it all very nicely under control.

In case I have confused many with what the elbow tuck consists of - it is similar to what the guy does with his glove tuck in this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-l38EuwPz_o at ~ 0:15 in the video.
 
highesteem1 said:
Hey all
I am posting a Interesting Video of LEG SPIN comparing with Steven Smith and My Son....

I hope Spinning community will comment ..... Link is here >>>

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dvOyWPXQOcI
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I've been given the task of looking after a kid at our cricket club this season as I'm one of only 2 wrist spinners in the club and although the other bloke who is 20-25 years younger than me and a far better spinner it seems I've been given the role as people are aware that I know about it and can talk the talk. But, I'll put my hands up here, although I write and talk about it, I'm no expert and would say that I am not a coach. But, in the role I've met other people who are real coaches, who know a little bit about the role of the coach for young wrist spinners and it does seem that I'm pretty on the ball when it comes to helping this kid.

Primarily, my role is to encourage the kid and make sure that he isn't put off what he is doing and a key part of that is to not do a great deal. This kid takes wickets with his Leg Breaks and has a Top-Spinner as well. The Leg breaks turn off the wicket and he gets drift and dip much of the time when he bowls. The key thing is he gives the ball a rip and it does what it is supposed to do through the air, sometime it's wayward - too short, full tosses and wides and he gets smacked around the park. Some days it doesn't turn much. But the fact is, what he does, despite the fact that he has an awkward bowling action - works most of the time and this keeps him interested and on-board with the idea of being the teams wrist spinner. The kid is 11.

As I said I do very little............
1. If it goes wrong for him I point out the positives, the key one being that almost every time he bowls he creates catching opportunites and they go to ground because his team mates are young still. As he gets older he'll get more wickets.
2. If it doesn't turn for him in training the only thing I suggest is that he tries the stand start drill, it always gets him back on track.

That's it.

The district coaches asked his Dad who was looking after him and he mentioned that it was me and asked what it was that I was doing and his Dad said the above. Their response was 'Perfect, all you need to do is encourage him if he's getting the ball to turn, DONT go messing around with anything if he is taking wickets, spinning the ball and enjoying it'.

From what I can see, the kid in the videos looks pretty good without comparing with anyone, so if he's getting the ball to spin I'd say it might be better to leave him be for a while and see how he gets on?
 
Hello - I am a new member, although I have been reading these threads for many months.
My son turned leg spinner from medium over the last year. Posting some videos
for your suggestions. Hardest part is how to fix some of these - help needed :)
Here are the videos from all sides.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uPS0nQOZG18
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pM4vGffilPU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ie25BVoWK6s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBGO_jZxGF8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A54VpuRXaLk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uPS0nQOZG18
 
tcs said:
Hello - I am a new member, although I have been reading these threads for many months.
My son turned leg spinner from medium over the last year. Posting some videos
for your suggestions. Hardest part is how to fix some of these - help needed :)
Here are the videos from all sides.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uPS0nQOZG18
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pM4vGffilPU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ie25BVoWK6s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBGO_jZxGF8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A54VpuRXaLk
[URL='http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uPS0nQOZG18[/quote']http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uPS0nQOZG18[/URL]
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Blimey! I reckon this is one for Liz. It's a very fast whippy kind of action and therefore quite unusual. I would have said that it looks like he's attempting to bowl too fast, but after reading some of Amol Rajan's book 'The Twirlymen' there's merit in ressurecting the art of fast wrist spinning if that's what he's looking to do. But going back to conventions, one of the key aspects of wrist spinning is getting the ball up in the air above the eye-line to give it some flight. From what i've just seen I reckon the balls flight is flat and therefore being bowled too fast? Does he get dip and drift when he bowls?
 
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