futureblackcap
Well-Known Member
I'm gonna post some bowling videos soon so you can pick at my bowling technique and give me advice
Wrist Spin Bowling (part Five)
- Thread starter Richard the Third
- Start date
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Get up there and post the Youtube link in here and we'll have a look.
Here is the last video. It pretty much shows where Im at. Some good balls but also too many bad ones inbetween including a big drag down, a wrong un on leg stump and another one down leg side. Good balls around it but I reckon Id still be belted for a couple of 4's per over. Its a lot better than 6 months ago though so I just have to keep working hard I guess.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5-rv0arZ9Fw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5-rv0arZ9Fw
Hey Chippyben!
Some nice deliveries. You bowl SOOO much better now you don't swing that back leg... SOO much better.
This next piece of advice though is related to that lack of back leg swing.
With the stepping across yourself. It's not too bad just as long as you keep the graphic above going. The line is drawn about your right or back leg. I think you naturally step across yourself because of your sort of strange head and body movements as you bend your back forward (trunk lean). Your trunk almost stays at this position below for the entire delivery stride. So naturally your arm is very upright or even past the vertical. To stay balanced about that line you step across yourself.
You stepping over yourself is more of an adaptation. There is plenty of anecdotal evidence that experienced bowlers are able to learn tricks to compensate for strange sorts of idiosyncratic mechanics. Experience with fast bowling helping you out there buddy!?
The problem is when you try to correct yourself that you pitch short. Don't you find it interesting how your first deliveries are always quite good, but then you start thinking about it and you suddenly drop short. Not enough stepping across yourself means you don't get enough of your body past that red line.
As I said earliet "This... piece of advice though is related to that lack of back leg swing." The less you swing the back leg the more of your body you will have to the left of picture or leg side of the red line. In other words if you swing your leg you move the right leg more and more to the leg side or to the left of the picture and so the red line moves more and more to the left of picture.
So I think lead more with your front hip which will get you more side on and more actually step across yourself more. Then try different head positions more to the leg side.
Thanks for the compliments mate and thanks for the analysis.
Are there 2 images missing?
I went up to the nets this arvo and tried keeping my head more upright rather than tilting away and getting my weight a little further to the right, or left as you look at the picture above rather than leaning back so much during the delivery. It was working ok and felt like I got a little more power through the action.
When you say lead with the hip do you mean having it as the closest part of the body to the stumps at the far end?
Ive been trying to get my shoulder high when I come into deliver and by doing so it gets the weight in the top half of the body back which seems to push the hip forward.
Also when you say I'm not swinging my leg anymore do you mean I am driving it through more and not just letting it lag behind me?
I haven't been bowling much lately so I need to get down the nets a bit more to work on these things.
My perenniel problem is still rushing through with my bowling arm, I had it just about fixed a month ago but having bowled so little Ive reverted back to the old way. Just a matter of timing really. When I get it right it feels like the bowling arm is doing ************ all and front arm pulling down and the body rotating just pulls the bowling arm with it but surprisingly it feels very powerful and gets the wrist really flicking at release.
Great work Jim, thanks for that. There was a off spinner bowling for the Bangles last night who was only bowling at 70kph. Shane Watson absolutely took him apart, getting the highest score for an Aussie in a ODI and also getting the most runs in bounderies ever.
I was looking at your vids and thought we were pretty similar in pace.
That pace is quite comfortable for me to bowl and I reckon when Im really getting my rhythm going it'd be about 5 kph faster. I can bowl a fast one, that I reckon would push up to 90kph. I'll have to film one and see if Im right.
Thanks Dave, yeah I couldn't believe it when I saw it drift on the video, I even asked the Mrs to have a look in case it was an illusion and I was just seeing what I wanted to see.
I think because I learnt it bowling with a rounder arm rather than a high arm its quite different to me than the leg break. Also my leg break (in my mind) has the wrist in the karate chop position so I think I use the cure for the googly syndrome as my natural ball.
I guess those big turning ones wouldn't be too bad if you stuck them right outside off stump. Hopefully you get a wicket with it but my theory of using the wrong un is to show them one and then they have to play all your leg breaks outside off stump in case it is the wrong un.
thats probably a little better than where I'm at with my bowling at present. add in another wide, and 1 or 2 of those good length balls dropping a yard short, and thats about my level of consistency. its getting better though and its still very early in the year in England, the competitive season doesn't start for another month yet. you're going well though, massive improvement over your videos from last year or early this year, so you're making constant progress which is Shane Warnes marker for a good cricketer.
with regards pace, you've got the advantage of being a fast bowler, so can deliver a ball at presumably 65mph+? the fastest I can physically bowl is about 55mph, and even then not on a consistent basis. so bowling that faster one is hard, but occasionally I'll nail a leg break and hit (at a guess) about 45-47mph, its very rare though. my flipper is a touch quicker, but my solo practice leg breaks hover around 37-41mph every ball. up against a batsman I tend to drop back to around 35-38mph because I flight the ball more for some reason. it has to be a mental block of some kind because I regularly overpitch against a batsman.
my main goal for the start of the season (which is fast approaching and I'm so busy with work I have zero practice time at the moment) is to be able to consistently land 4 out of 6 balls per over (all leg breaks) on a good line and length at the kind of pace I can achieve in nets. then from there I'll look to expand. the variations are pointless at the moment if I'm going to be expensive with my stock ball. you can't use a variation unless you set the batsman up, and you can't do that without consistency and pressure. my variations lack purpose in nets so its hard to practice them against batsmen (or even solo). my tactics I think are hugely improved, I'm reading players a lot better and a lot faster than I was before (my improvement as a batsman is helping my understanding of things as well) so hopefully that will be to my advantage. just need a captain willing to give me input on the field settings now!!
I reckon practicing regularly is the key. Ive been flat out with work lately too and bowled very little and it feels like you go back a few steps when you get back into it.
When I first started bowling leg spin in the nets against batsman I never used to follow through properly. It took ages to force myself to follow through. Its really strange isnt it that a batsman has such an effect on us. When I start bowling bad to batsman thats usually the reason but now at least I can recognise the problem and try and fix it.
I think you are spot on with just concentrating on the leg break. Landing 4 out of 6 sounds like a good an acheivable goal. If you could do that then you would probably get away with one of the bad ones and maybe just get hit on the other one. And hey rubbish gets wickets sometimes too!! The other 4 are real wicket taking balls then and you should get a bag full of wickets, fingers crossed.
Most medium pacers bowl 2 bad balls an over too.
the problem is those dibbly dobbly 40mph medium pacers or 30mph part-time offies that land 60 perfect deliveries a match and go at 2 runs per over. theyre the bowlers stealing my 10 overs in the middle, because in 42 over cricket, captains rarely look at the bigger picture of taking 10 wickets. you can win the game simply by restricting the runs if you bowl first, and if youre bowling second then youve got to take the 10 wickets, but then they look at the "expensive" leg spinner as giving away valuable runs they cant afford, rather than as a wicket taking threat. the plight of a developing leg spinner!!
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Yeah that's my kind of theory with the wrong un. I reckon if I was bowling them on a regular basis and could land them where I wanted, I'd get one in during the first over - 5th or 6th ball just outside of the off-stump just to let them know it's there and that they need to be wary. The big turners outside of off as Macca says (I think) just signals that the balls likely to be a wrong un and they just step back and play off the back foot. A smaller wrong un I reckons the more affective.
as Warnie always says though, its one thing to pick the delivery, but they've still got to play it. and with big turn, its always incredibly hard work. if you've got a consistent big turning wrong'un you can pitch one up well outside off and then it will turn in big. first time they see that chances are they won't expect it, so if its full enough to get them forwards or attempting a cut shot (expecting a leg break) then theres a great chance of bowling them through the gate. 2nd time you throw it up they'll know its a wrong'un and so will play for it expecting it to turn in. they might connect, they might not, but let them try. throw it up again with top spin, again outside off stump, and if they play for turn they might well find an edge, anything can happen. I wouldn't write off any big turning delivery as being useless. the same can apply to big turning leg breaks as its far too much turn to find an edge, but batsmen do stupid things against big turn, and you bring your straight-on balls (deliberate or not) into play big time!!
doctortran
Member
The left image is from your recent video and the right image is from a past video.
Check the difference in distance of the lines. The right has your leg further out and is what I call swinging the leg. Keep the leg in and you are more balanced. Get that head closer and you end up getting more of your body behind the ball.
A rule you could try: Never let your right knee be the furthest body part on your right or leg side. In delivery stride let your right hip or arm do that job. In follow through let your right foot do that job.
This idea is I think the essence of spinning up -- of bowling upwards. Your hip and leg roll up so your knee doesn't swing causing you to lose balance and open up.
Compare to Warne. His Gatting ball after all is the perfect leg break.
And how about when he doesn't keep that knee from swinging.
The angle of the shot makes this seem more exaggerated than in reality however it serves as indicative. Some will notice this as the Warne to Chanderpaul at Sydney spinning it half the width of the pitch. It lands slightly short -- if you don't spin it in the footmarks like Warney you'll pitch short and get smacked for four.
Or as in vs VVS Laxman who makes 287.
The knee goes out further than his hip. His knee follows through or swings before the leg can come around. Drops short and gets hit for four.
Or perhaps here when Warne drops short and leg side-ish to be leg glanced. Laxman reaches his hundred.
Some examples of good deliveries where the right hip is further out than the knee. Result is bowled Warne and bowled Warne.
Check the difference in distance of the lines. The right has your leg further out and is what I call swinging the leg. Keep the leg in and you are more balanced. Get that head closer and you end up getting more of your body behind the ball.
A rule you could try: Never let your right knee be the furthest body part on your right or leg side. In delivery stride let your right hip or arm do that job. In follow through let your right foot do that job.
This idea is I think the essence of spinning up -- of bowling upwards. Your hip and leg roll up so your knee doesn't swing causing you to lose balance and open up.
Compare to Warne. His Gatting ball after all is the perfect leg break.
And how about when he doesn't keep that knee from swinging.
The angle of the shot makes this seem more exaggerated than in reality however it serves as indicative. Some will notice this as the Warne to Chanderpaul at Sydney spinning it half the width of the pitch. It lands slightly short -- if you don't spin it in the footmarks like Warney you'll pitch short and get smacked for four.
Or as in vs VVS Laxman who makes 287.
The knee goes out further than his hip. His knee follows through or swings before the leg can come around. Drops short and gets hit for four.
Or perhaps here when Warne drops short and leg side-ish to be leg glanced. Laxman reaches his hundred.
Some examples of good deliveries where the right hip is further out than the knee. Result is bowled Warne and bowled Warne.
Kiran Rajkumar
Member
Do any of you guys follow the IPL? Shane Warne has been bowling beautifully. He has got figures of 2-21 and 2-17 in 4 overs in 2 matches.
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Yeah just watched the highlights of the RR's on one of the internet highlight packages. Nice first over 2 wickets for 2 runs, the old dogs still got it in him.
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
I think my big turner is relatively slower than the rest of my deliveries and make it easier to play. Saying that I was playing around with it today trying to bowl it faster and it seemed to be fine, I think I'm just a bit paranoid about the Googly Syndrome, as I can go back to bowling really big turning Wrong Uns as easy as anything, it's just that they need some work on the length and speed and that will take a bit of commitment and then the fear kicks in!!!
doctortran
Member
It's fantastic isn't it? Follow these links for the full match. He's turning it really big and quick. Some of those deliveries that just beat the batsman -- reminds you of the good old days.
Navigate through the Indiatimes website to find smaller highlights packages.
Match 2 (FULL)
http://www.youtube.com/user/indiatimes#p/c/49C484518E88931C/3/0Y6B9dpB-Zo
Match 7 (FULL)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rPrOVb0VkcQ
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Nice one Doc me and the boys were looking for the full matches and couldn't find them. The whole matches are being aired on the tele here in the UK from 11.00 through to 7pm, but life these days doesn't really allow for sitting around for 8 hours during the day to watch cricket, so these links are brilliant cheers!
Yes big turn isn't much good if its bowled slowly and comes off the pitch slowly, I agree.
When I bowl my wrong un I have my fingers pointing horizontally towards mid on rather than towards the sky. That makes it feel very different in my mind to a leg break.
When I played over in England there seemed to be no end of these medium pace bowlers who bowled boring balls on a good length and never tried anything. Occasionally you would get a batsman who had a bit of attacking flair and predicted where they would pitch it every ball and belted them but that was rare. We played 45 over matches and it seemed that keeping runs down was top priority. To be fair it worked well for us one season as we won the league with only one batsman and 5 very accurate bowlers. ( I second topped scored for the season aggregate, that shows how rubbish our batting was)
It was boring though, I remember one game where we made 150 odd and the other team ran out of overs with there score in the 80's. The grounds we played on were tiny too so scores should have been a lot higher.
When I started playing back in Australia it was strange to see run rates of 5 or 6 an over and scores of 300 being scored.