someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Wrist Spin Bowling
And here it is - Right who's starting?
And here it is - Right who's starting?
Wrist Spin Bowling
- Thread starter someblokecalleddave
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mas cambios
Active Member
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling
I've already started to put together a kind of "Key Points" as I see it type of document based on the stuff we've been discussing since December 2007 and here it is -
Having now made contributions to this thread over a period of months we're getting to the point where we need to rotate some of the key points that we're all agreeing on. Here's some of the points that seem to be re-occuring.
1. If you're starting out with Leg Spin concentrate on being able to bowl the Leg Break. Don't worry about all the variations, just make sure that you're able to bowl this delivery and that it's your main weapon against the batsman.
2. Familiarise yourself with the videos that are available on-line via youtube - there's one with Shane Warne himself at the Wacca and 2 with Terry Jenner one from the BBC and the other is part of the Cloverdale video series. All of these videos are helpful.
3. If you can learn with a coach - it's gotta be the best way surely?
4. Leg Spin/Wrist spin is acknowledged as being potentially the most difficult form of bowling so be prepared to put some hours in getting it right - be prepared for the long haul.
5. Practice, practice and more practice.
6. Look after your shoulder - check out the threads relating to shoulder exercises to prevent injury.
7. At the earliest point borrow, steal or buy Peter Philpotts book - "[ame=http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/1861260636?&camp=2486&creative=10522&linkCode=waf&tag=simplycricket-21]The Art of Wrist Spin[/ame]". Read it and follow the instructions!
Finally - again and again people in the know say the same thing and I've learnt through bitter experience - learn to bowl the Leg Break well before moving on to the variations.
So there's our Wrist Spin bowling manifesto!
I've already started to put together a kind of "Key Points" as I see it type of document based on the stuff we've been discussing since December 2007 and here it is -
Having now made contributions to this thread over a period of months we're getting to the point where we need to rotate some of the key points that we're all agreeing on. Here's some of the points that seem to be re-occuring.
1. If you're starting out with Leg Spin concentrate on being able to bowl the Leg Break. Don't worry about all the variations, just make sure that you're able to bowl this delivery and that it's your main weapon against the batsman.
2. Familiarise yourself with the videos that are available on-line via youtube - there's one with Shane Warne himself at the Wacca and 2 with Terry Jenner one from the BBC and the other is part of the Cloverdale video series. All of these videos are helpful.
3. If you can learn with a coach - it's gotta be the best way surely?
4. Leg Spin/Wrist spin is acknowledged as being potentially the most difficult form of bowling so be prepared to put some hours in getting it right - be prepared for the long haul.
5. Practice, practice and more practice.
6. Look after your shoulder - check out the threads relating to shoulder exercises to prevent injury.
7. At the earliest point borrow, steal or buy Peter Philpotts book - "[ame=http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/1861260636?&camp=2486&creative=10522&linkCode=waf&tag=simplycricket-21]The Art of Wrist Spin[/ame]". Read it and follow the instructions!
Finally - again and again people in the know say the same thing and I've learnt through bitter experience - learn to bowl the Leg Break well before moving on to the variations.
So there's our Wrist Spin bowling manifesto!
mas cambios
Active Member
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling
Cheers for that, a pretty good summary of where to start I think.
Cheers for that, a pretty good summary of where to start I think.
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling
No worries! I've learned loads from being on here, so it's the least I can do. I'm looking forward to learning more still, hopefully what with it not being so big unweildy more people might make contributions?
mas cambios said:
No worries! I've learned loads from being on here, so it's the least I can do. I'm looking forward to learning more still, hopefully what with it not being so big unweildy more people might make contributions?
mas cambios
Active Member
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling
I think they will, it's getting better :laugh:. Takes time to build a forum and a steady member base but we are getting there and threads like the old leg spin one help no end.
I'm also hoping to get someone to do an interview with regards to spin bowling in the vein of what we did with Ian Pont, so hopefully that will come off in the not too distant future (Sadly, Peter Philpott may be out of the question but I will try).
I think they will, it's getting better :laugh:. Takes time to build a forum and a steady member base but we are getting there and threads like the old leg spin one help no end.
I'm also hoping to get someone to do an interview with regards to spin bowling in the vein of what we did with Ian Pont, so hopefully that will come off in the not too distant future (Sadly, Peter Philpott may be out of the question but I will try).
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling
That'd be good if you could get Peter Phipott! No doubt all those people make a living out of talking about what they do and how they do it, so yeah I'd be very surprised if you came up with a result on that front! But no doubt worth a try?
That'd be good if you could get Peter Phipott! No doubt all those people make a living out of talking about what they do and how they do it, so yeah I'd be very surprised if you came up with a result on that front! But no doubt worth a try?
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling
Gundalf - how you doing mate? I always notice that you're looking and having a read, you're one of the most consistent viewers of the thread, so I reckon you must bowl Leg Spin - how's it going?
Gundalf - how you doing mate? I always notice that you're looking and having a read, you're one of the most consistent viewers of the thread, so I reckon you must bowl Leg Spin - how's it going?
mas cambios
Active Member
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling
I have been looking for Philpott but I don't think it'll be a goer. Little did I realise that the guy is in his mid 70's and seems to have retired from coaching a few years ago. If I can find him, then I will at the very least ask.
someblokecalleddave said:
I have been looking for Philpott but I don't think it'll be a goer. Little did I realise that the guy is in his mid 70's and seems to have retired from coaching a few years ago. If I can find him, then I will at the very least ask.
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling
I thought that myself, in the book he looks like he's knocking on a bit, so I'm surprised that he's still alive to tell the truth!
I thought that myself, in the book he looks like he's knocking on a bit, so I'm surprised that he's still alive to tell the truth!
mas cambios
Active Member
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling
He is still going strong, shame that there is only a brief bit of info on Cricinfo and Wiki, seems he filled the gap between Benaud and Hohn in the Aussie side. From what I can gather though, he was passionate about the art of wrist spin and developing it, especially in the pace dominated 70's and 80's and pre-Warne.
He is still going strong, shame that there is only a brief bit of info on Cricinfo and Wiki, seems he filled the gap between Benaud and Hohn in the Aussie side. From what I can gather though, he was passionate about the art of wrist spin and developing it, especially in the pace dominated 70's and 80's and pre-Warne.
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling
Yeah in the book "The art of wrist spin bowling" the intro looks at the history of wrist spin and he writes in there about the 70's and 80's saying that wrist spin bowling virtually died (I think that includes finger spin as well) and he credits Warne almost single handedly as being the key element in it's revival and the fact that Jenner and a few other Aussies including himself continued coaching the discipline through the dark ages of wrist spin in the latter half of the 80's when countries such as Sri Lanka officially gave up on both wrist spin and finger spin. Philpott, Jenner and a few others kept badgering the Australian cricket board to keep wrist spin on the agenda and they did and finally through the youth policies and training came Warne and we all know what happened then.
You should read the book - or at least the first couple of chapters, it gives an insight into this fascinating aspect of cricket.
Yeah in the book "The art of wrist spin bowling" the intro looks at the history of wrist spin and he writes in there about the 70's and 80's saying that wrist spin bowling virtually died (I think that includes finger spin as well) and he credits Warne almost single handedly as being the key element in it's revival and the fact that Jenner and a few other Aussies including himself continued coaching the discipline through the dark ages of wrist spin in the latter half of the 80's when countries such as Sri Lanka officially gave up on both wrist spin and finger spin. Philpott, Jenner and a few others kept badgering the Australian cricket board to keep wrist spin on the agenda and they did and finally through the youth policies and training came Warne and we all know what happened then.
You should read the book - or at least the first couple of chapters, it gives an insight into this fascinating aspect of cricket.
mysteryspinner
New Member
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling
3 questions:
1) How long and fast is your run up. Usually mine is about 4 paces but experimenting with running about 7 paces before bowling
2) Never read anything about whether the shiny side should be placed when bowling. Kumble sometimes seems to be placing it meticulously to one side but as there is no close up difficult to say. By law of magnus probably should only work with backspinner but any ideas.
3) No matter how i bowl seam always seems to go this way //. Admittedly i do not flick the wrist much due to old age :cry :cry
It would be massive to get Mr Philpott's views, he is passionate and a genius imo. A video would do
Great thread keep it up
3 questions:
1) How long and fast is your run up. Usually mine is about 4 paces but experimenting with running about 7 paces before bowling
2) Never read anything about whether the shiny side should be placed when bowling. Kumble sometimes seems to be placing it meticulously to one side but as there is no close up difficult to say. By law of magnus probably should only work with backspinner but any ideas.
3) No matter how i bowl seam always seems to go this way //. Admittedly i do not flick the wrist much due to old age :cry :cry
It would be massive to get Mr Philpott's views, he is passionate and a genius imo. A video would do
Great thread keep it up
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling
Mystery spinner I can't believe you're older than me mate! Run up is something I've not addressed with any vigour as yet, but is something I change around quite a bit. Currently I use a Warnesque style a few paces walking in and then 3 or 4 where it speeds up as I go in to the delivery. I have a problem it's been observed where I don't use my hips to drive forward and my team mates reckon this is to the detriment of my speed (I'm excrutiatingly slow) and something I need to work on. The thing is I have so many different variations some of them require slightly different run-ups and it's a case of I just do what feels right and helps me get the ball up the other end. At the moment all my focus and concentration is on bowling Leg Breaks and getting the wrist flick mastered so my run-in is taking a back seat for the minute. But in a nutshell mine is short and slow.
Mystery spinner I can't believe you're older than me mate! Run up is something I've not addressed with any vigour as yet, but is something I change around quite a bit. Currently I use a Warnesque style a few paces walking in and then 3 or 4 where it speeds up as I go in to the delivery. I have a problem it's been observed where I don't use my hips to drive forward and my team mates reckon this is to the detriment of my speed (I'm excrutiatingly slow) and something I need to work on. The thing is I have so many different variations some of them require slightly different run-ups and it's a case of I just do what feels right and helps me get the ball up the other end. At the moment all my focus and concentration is on bowling Leg Breaks and getting the wrist flick mastered so my run-in is taking a back seat for the minute. But in a nutshell mine is short and slow.
Ripping-LegBreak
New Member
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling
Hi with lots of practice, ive finnaly got control of my standard leg break and i have tried to develop some variations like a topspinner but it keeps spinning like a leg break but with bounce, maybe its because my leg break release is like a top spinner release but i flick my wrist sideways rather than forwards,my leg break release is when the thumb faces the batsmen and it finishes facing the offside instead of finishing straight.
Hi with lots of practice, ive finnaly got control of my standard leg break and i have tried to develop some variations like a topspinner but it keeps spinning like a leg break but with bounce, maybe its because my leg break release is like a top spinner release but i flick my wrist sideways rather than forwards,my leg break release is when the thumb faces the batsmen and it finishes facing the offside instead of finishing straight.
mysteryspinner
New Member
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling
Sorry to disappoint you but am only 40 years young. Very annoying when i release the ball the seam is always // like a small googlie with loads of topspin, rather than \\ ie seam pointing to slip or point. Tried to rectify by starting under arm and round arm again but little success. I am also very round arm i think i should try to get my hand more vertical as on the front cover of philpott where there is a picture of warne.
I seem to be giving up the art leave it to the young supple kids. we should form a geriatrics 11 on this site with the place of leg spinner going to the person that can see the stumps through dense cataracts :laugh:
Sorry to disappoint you but am only 40 years young. Very annoying when i release the ball the seam is always // like a small googlie with loads of topspin, rather than \\ ie seam pointing to slip or point. Tried to rectify by starting under arm and round arm again but little success. I am also very round arm i think i should try to get my hand more vertical as on the front cover of philpott where there is a picture of warne.
I seem to be giving up the art leave it to the young supple kids. we should form a geriatrics 11 on this site with the place of leg spinner going to the person that can see the stumps through dense cataracts :laugh:
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling
You're a youngster then mate I'm nearly eight years your senior! Good to have you on board as a contributor, hope I can learn something from you? Surely it's not that bad? You'll put all these young blokes here off of getting old, they'll all be giving cricket up as soon as they're 25!
I take it you've got the Philpott book? If so you need to take on board the advice right at the beginning where he talks about spinning the ball from hand to hand but also in towards your chest. It's this backwards towards your chest spinning which is the secret to getting your big Leg Break spin. Although I've got to concede it's not easy by any stretch of the imagination. Philpott talks about doing it relentlessly as much as you can - which is okay if you're 15 or maybe even 19 but when you're 47 you do look like someone who needs care in the community! My wife thinks I've lost the plot! But yeah you really have got to do the - Spin everything you can get your hands on - thing. In time you'll get the flick. But it's then converting that back-spin into a bowling action over your head that is tricky and takes a lot of concentration and application. I'm getting there bit by bit.
In fact today I've had a really productive day. One of the key features of which was to incorporate someone's advice from a post on the old leg spin thread. The advice was to raise your leading arm high at the beginning of the bowling action, but also hold the ball above your head at the very start at the bowling action too. I've had two practice sessions today, the earlier session I incorporated this into my bowling and I had amazing practice. But then later I practiced again and in comparison was rubbish, but then towards the end of the session I suddenly realised I'd not been doing the raise the arms high at the start of the bowling action. As soon as I did this - it all came right again. I'm not saying this is going to work for everyone, but it may be something to look at and experiment with? I'm going to look at the Jenner and warne vid's on youtube and look at their arm positions and see if this is a characteristic of their bowling?
You're a youngster then mate I'm nearly eight years your senior! Good to have you on board as a contributor, hope I can learn something from you? Surely it's not that bad? You'll put all these young blokes here off of getting old, they'll all be giving cricket up as soon as they're 25!
I take it you've got the Philpott book? If so you need to take on board the advice right at the beginning where he talks about spinning the ball from hand to hand but also in towards your chest. It's this backwards towards your chest spinning which is the secret to getting your big Leg Break spin. Although I've got to concede it's not easy by any stretch of the imagination. Philpott talks about doing it relentlessly as much as you can - which is okay if you're 15 or maybe even 19 but when you're 47 you do look like someone who needs care in the community! My wife thinks I've lost the plot! But yeah you really have got to do the - Spin everything you can get your hands on - thing. In time you'll get the flick. But it's then converting that back-spin into a bowling action over your head that is tricky and takes a lot of concentration and application. I'm getting there bit by bit.
In fact today I've had a really productive day. One of the key features of which was to incorporate someone's advice from a post on the old leg spin thread. The advice was to raise your leading arm high at the beginning of the bowling action, but also hold the ball above your head at the very start at the bowling action too. I've had two practice sessions today, the earlier session I incorporated this into my bowling and I had amazing practice. But then later I practiced again and in comparison was rubbish, but then towards the end of the session I suddenly realised I'd not been doing the raise the arms high at the start of the bowling action. As soon as I did this - it all came right again. I'm not saying this is going to work for everyone, but it may be something to look at and experiment with? I'm going to look at the Jenner and warne vid's on youtube and look at their arm positions and see if this is a characteristic of their bowling?
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling
This is just a case of rotating your hand/wrist more to rectify it. I have a similar tendency to do the opposite. I have a very vertical arm with my bowling action and as a result my Top-spinners turn slightly and become wrong-uns with loads of bounce. To be honest I'm not that fussed as it's fairly inconsistent and on a real wicket they're generally straight-ish. You just need to move your wrist slightly.
This is also useful to everyone but was posted in the wrong place by Basit770......
Hi there! I have just written a short article explaining how young leg spinners can improve. If you like my article, scroll down and click on "I Like It"
Hope you will like it
http://www.sportales.com/Cricket/Tips-for-Young-Leg-Spin-Bowlers.129513
There is the link ^^
Basit770 - yep I like it.
This is good fun as well - Shane Warne bowling against a kid and telling him what to do - [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f5ilQRqRDWI&feature=related"]YouTube - The day I faced Shane Warne[/ame]
Ripping-LegBreak said:
This is just a case of rotating your hand/wrist more to rectify it. I have a similar tendency to do the opposite. I have a very vertical arm with my bowling action and as a result my Top-spinners turn slightly and become wrong-uns with loads of bounce. To be honest I'm not that fussed as it's fairly inconsistent and on a real wicket they're generally straight-ish. You just need to move your wrist slightly.
This is also useful to everyone but was posted in the wrong place by Basit770......
Hi there! I have just written a short article explaining how young leg spinners can improve. If you like my article, scroll down and click on "I Like It"
Hope you will like it
http://www.sportales.com/Cricket/Tips-for-Young-Leg-Spin-Bowlers.129513
There is the link ^^
Basit770 - yep I like it.
This is good fun as well - Shane Warne bowling against a kid and telling him what to do - [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f5ilQRqRDWI&feature=related"]YouTube - The day I faced Shane Warne[/ame]
gundalf7
Active Member
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling
looks like a good article some good tips in there and good to here that your never too late to start leg spin
on the subject of my bowling didn't get much of a bowl in the uni season due to my finger not fully healing but still ended up having a good bowl and ended up with decent figures in the 2 matches though was a bit off line in the one game.
seem to be recovered now and bowling well though got about 8 or 9 deliveries plus a few variations going well with about 80-90% accuracy
currently working on the backspinner at the moment nailed a few but still feels awkward bowling it though, currently trying to find if i can get games in midweek with my local team i practice with as unfortunately i'm working weekends
looks like a good article some good tips in there and good to here that your never too late to start leg spin
on the subject of my bowling didn't get much of a bowl in the uni season due to my finger not fully healing but still ended up having a good bowl and ended up with decent figures in the 2 matches though was a bit off line in the one game.
seem to be recovered now and bowling well though got about 8 or 9 deliveries plus a few variations going well with about 80-90% accuracy
currently working on the backspinner at the moment nailed a few but still feels awkward bowling it though, currently trying to find if i can get games in midweek with my local team i practice with as unfortunately i'm working weekends
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling
What back spinner are you trying - The Slider or the Flipper?
What back spinner are you trying - The Slider or the Flipper?
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