Wrist Spin Bowling (part Five)

Top Contributors
boogiespinner said:
Mate I'll be honest, I'm concerned about you running in, if you can make it to the end of the season off the gentle run up I think that would be extremely sensible. Take this from someone who could not even run for a bus for literally years due to chronic achilles problems, and that was through my late thirties. It was only when I realised that I might never be able to walk again without problems that I totally cut out stressing it. As I understand it, it takes three months for any new cartilage growth to fully mature. Please treat this injury with a lot of respect. It's very easy not to, because you can easily run through it at the time... until you can't anymore.
Click to expand...
No more games this season now but potential to continue practicing. I've bowled 3 nights in a row more than 100 balls a night and it's fine at the moment - slightly tender if I squeeze it to be honest. What did you do then to recover and how long did it take? In the next few weeks the weather will close in here and I'll potentially stop bowling. What do you recommend?
 
Cleanprophet said:
Is there a reason you are bowling around the wicket? There's some obvious balance issues there. At the point of delivery you are falling away to the left quite sharply, hence the follow through. Incidently, some of those follow throughs do look quite funny the way you're walking away to your left whilst looking back over your right shoulder. It looks like you've just cracked a joke at the bar and then walked away with a little wink.

Above all else, the thing that stands out is that you're not really getting that explosion at the crease. I know you've always said you are more of a roller than a ripper. But, I think you could still do with a little bit more energy. It would probably help with the balance and follow through. There's inconsistency in the line and length and that's because of that position at the crease and follow through. As you know, you want that follow through to be a lot straighter. I had a very similar problem and I found a bit more momentum into the crease kept me on the line I wanted to be on.
Click to expand...

Just trying it out - I rarely bowl round the wicket in matches, I do this some times when I'm trying to bowl with more spin, I place the mat wider and wider and spin the ball in off the mat into the stumps do develop accuracy and spin. The falling away thing - people have mentioned before, but to be honest as I recall the ball spun far more and had more fizz on it when I did this. I'm watching the ball to see if it's going to knock the tripod over!

Explosion at the crease - yep make you right there, it looks like it massively lacks any sense of dynamism or energy, but this may come by my reckoning as I ease into this new method. On looking at the video I was disappointed and for a moment thought I need to run in off 5 steps then I tried it last night and it felt totally wrong. I've bowled against my son tonight in the nets using this approach and it's worked well, but it is a work in progress. It may also be the case that I bowl with slightly more energy and I'm less experimental when bowling against someone. I've probably picked the worse of the three videos I shot. I'll edit one of the others and upload that, I'm sure with that - ball after ball was on the off-stump. In this video I was trying all sorts.

But, going back to the explosion at the crease part of it, I'm aware that this isn't happening, but this is a completely new method, one of the things I noticed was my leading arm looks a little weak in the action. What I want to do first is get the 3 steps and then into the bowling action right first - including getting more side on. There's a lot of work yet.
 
boogiespinner said:
It's really helpful to see you bowling off the gentle run-up because it is clearer to see what you are doing.

I have to echo CP Dave... your action is looking to me like there is something fundamentally not correct. I think it's your pivoting. Are you powering through the rotation by grinding the left heel into the ground or are you coming up on the toe before delivering the ball?
Click to expand...
Yeah in this vid, the pivot is weak and the leg doesn't come up and through. There's a lot of work to be done, I've basically got to re-learn a load of stuff and I'm starting from ground zero almost.
 
Cleanprophet said:
It almost looks like his follow through is going to take him around the stumps and back to his starting position. It's got to be hard to get much fizz on the ball if your momentum isn't heading at the target. In terms of energy and power, it is the same for all bowlers. Any seam bowler who's follow through didn't take him towards the target would not have any pace at all. Obviously, a spin bowler looks to convert a lot of that energy into revs rather than pace through the air. If that energy isn't there, the ball won't have many revs on it. If it is bowled at about 40mph and has very little drift or dip, then a lot of batters will go at it hard. Unfortunately, the only way to combat that is to get the ball coming out at about 45mph-50mph with a decent amount of drift and dip. That means hitting the crease with lots of momentum and following through down the crease.

I reckon Dave could use his front arm a lot more too. He could pull that down a touch later and with a bit more effort.
Click to expand...
I think another thing you have to keep in mind and I have to consider and keep in perspective is that I'm 55 and only a small bloke, I'm probably less fit at this stage of the year in comparison to previous years too. The front arm point is totally valid and with some upper body strength and conditioning I maybe able to get more energy and power into the arms and shoulders, but that'll be next year. But then I'll be nearly 56 - not getting any younger!
 
For me, the important thing is that for the first time in 8 years or so I'm aware that I have a run-in. It's fixed, that's how I'm going to do it and that's what I have to work with. That for me is a massive step and should have been one that I resolved 8, 7 , 6 years ago, not 2 weeks ago! But, not having a coach or trainer that is knowledgeable enough for me to take notice of, I've learned everything arse about face, Googlies, Flippers and what have you all off of a ropey base as such. I looked again at the Macgill video and it's all in there, he says all the things you need to do, but somehow I missed the emphasis of what it is that he is saying (Must be a learning deficiency I have or I just get excited about the final outcome and miss all the detail and background stuff along the way)?
 
Cleanprophet said:
I would think anyone could come off a 10 step approach and still be slower at the crease than some people who come off a one step approach. That's simply because it's not so much the length of the approach but the build of momentum in that approach. The key things are balance and rhythm because you can build momentum with that. If you see stills of Yasir Shah as he jumps into the crease, you can see huge energy going into the crease. Warne's is interesting because he does walk in and breaks into a bit of a sprint in the last 3 or 4 strides:



That 'explosion' at the crease is what it is all about and whatever length of approach it takes to get that with balance and rhythm is a good approach.
Click to expand...

T
Cleanprophet said:
I would think anyone could come off a 10 step approach and still be slower at the crease than some people who come off a one step approach. That's simply because it's not so much the length of the approach but the build of momentum in that approach. The key things are balance and rhythm because you can build momentum with that. If you see stills of Yasir Shah as he jumps into the crease, you can see huge energy going into the crease. Warne's is interesting because he does walk in and breaks into a bit of a sprint in the last 3 or 4 strides:



That 'explosion' at the crease is what it is all about and whatever length of approach it takes to get that with balance and rhythm is a good approach.
Click to expand...

hats a very interesting video, i didnt know he sprinted in the last 3 strides Thanks!
 
boogiespinner said:
I think though that there's a danger of the horse just running loose, if that makes sense. I think putting in more effort is not complicated. The tricky part is developing technique so that the extra effort is harnessed.
Click to expand...

For sure. This is an area I think I had problems with. My approach has always been quite slow and not really carrying much momentum. The problem with that is that I had generate all the energy through sheer effort (using force/muscles) and that puts strain on technique. So I did need more momentum from my run up but, as you say, you have be careful because it's not just a case of running in a bit quicker. You have to have balance and rhythm whether your approach is slow or quick, so you have to work on getting more momentum in your run up whilst maintaining that balance and control.
 
someblokecalleddave said:
For me, the important thing is that for the first time in 8 years or so I'm aware that I have a run-in. It's fixed, that's how I'm going to do it and that's what I have to work with. That for me is a massive step and should have been one that I resolved 8, 7 , 6 years ago, not 2 weeks ago! But, not having a coach or trainer that is knowledgeable enough for me to take notice of, I've learned everything arse about face, Googlies, Flippers and what have you all off of a ropey base as such. I looked again at the Macgill video and it's all in there, he says all the things you need to do, but somehow I missed the emphasis of what it is that he is saying (Must be a learning deficiency I have or I just get excited about the final outcome and miss all the detail and background stuff along the way)?
Click to expand...

In many ways I'm in the same position. I never had a very productive run up and my wrist didn't cock as much as it should have done, but I never bothered to work on. There are things I am putting right at the moment. It does feel a bit like starting from scratch, but it isn't. There's lots of work done that someone starting from scratch doesn't have.

You're right though. That MacGill video does cover the things that are important and anyone coming the legspin could do worse than follow everything he says. In many ways, he is a much better bowler to emulate than Warne is.
 
someblokecalleddave said:
Click to expand...


I loved that big toe end-on 0.23. I laughed plenty at that footballing interlude!

Looks a lot better from over the wicket. That ball just before the football rolls to you looks pretty good to me. It seemed to just drift in a bit at the end. It landed on the mat and that line and length is perfect for that type of delivery. No batter can go after that without it being risky.
 
someblokecalleddave said:
Click to expand...

Like where that action is going, bit of Mushtaq Ahmed to it.

I've got some advice below which you should take a grain of salt as all bowling actions are unique.

One comment, which repeats what Cleanprophet has said, try to follow through at your target. There's a couple of reasons for this:
  • Spin - When you fall away from your right to your left your bowling arm compensates by slightly coming through at an angle that favours topspin over legspin.
  • Accuracy - Let's say your perfect follow through goes at 20 degrees (where 0 degrees is toward your target), how do you actually know when you are going at 20 degrees? By following through at your target you have a point of reference you can consistently look to when bowling. By following through at an undefined target you are completely reliant on it just feeling good.
 
someblokecalleddave said:
No more games this season now but potential to continue practicing. I've bowled 3 nights in a row more than 100 balls a night and it's fine at the moment - slightly tender if I squeeze it to be honest. What did you do then to recover and how long did it take? In the next few weeks the weather will close in here and I'll potentially stop bowling. What do you recommend?
Click to expand...
Main thing was I stopped all running, and about six years. It's still not 100%. I heard a rule of thumb was that once it's a chronic problem it will take as long to heal as it has been chronic. I had really battered it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top