only Yanks can revitalize world cricket

Re: only Yanks can revitalize world cricket

Chandu-

Wow...$100 million "golden pot"? Now we're talking! Why are you comparing Oreck vacuums and Vegemite to the sports industry here in the US? Those are 3 totally different industry markets here. And yet you want to continue to badger me about my background in business. Now who is losing credibility? My use of poker in my post was to show the mentality of Americans when it comes to making a sport more competitive in the US market and producing high caliber players from people who probably never would have thought to want to learn how to play because now there are incentives to want to be good at it. You may think that poker is not a "sport" but it is competitive nature, just like cricket, and not like vacuums and Vegemite. But you're right, we should just sit and watch cricket grow at the organic/grassroots level here in the US using..."baby steps"?? So we should see cricket at a decent competitive level here in the States in the year...what...3006...if that? Cricket will not grow if you leave it to grassroots level of growth because to the majority of Americans, cricket is long, boring, and complicated, and there is no incentive to learn how to play. My point is not to sell cricket here, but to give it national exposure and give people more of an incentive to learn to play cricket and increase the competitive level than what it is today. The bottom line here is that we are trying to get the US to be more competitive in the cricket world. You're not going to produce decent World Cup level cricket players at a grassroots level here in the US, when there are no incentives.


Stamislav-

You are right, the infrastructure and fields to play on are crap. But once you gain national exposure to the sport and give incentives to be good at playing cricket, people here will want a decent infrastructure to keep the sport going here and with that infrastructure, they will push for better playing fields. But I think we can do with the fields that we have, if we give everyone incentives to play the sport. Take a look at Puerto Rico, Mexico, Cuba, etc. with respect to baseball. Have you seen the fields they play on? Yet they use what they have because there are incentives to be good at the sport because one day they could play in the MLB here in the States, and make millions of dollars. Lacrosse and field hockey are popular in high school and universities because there are incentives...college scholarships.


OK, so once again, "market the crap"..."show the money."
 
Re: only Yanks can revitalize world cricket

Stamislav;125224 said:
There is virtually no good place to watch a game of cricket in all of North America.

I think the Sky Dome in Toronto is one of the best places to watch cricket in North America. They had held official international ODIs between India vs. Pakistan a number of times. I was there once. They can open up the roof, if I remember it right. It was in the month of September and somehow there were no clashes with Blue Jays baseball schedule.

I heard Blue Jays are interested in leaving Sky Dome to build their own stadium somewhere else. If that happens, Sky Dome should be declared official home of cricket for all of North America. Weather in the summer is fantastic in Toronto. Nothing would be better than holding cricket tournaments under CN Tower as annual tradition.
 
Re: only Yanks can revitalize world cricket

kudu;125229 said:
Why are you comparing Oreck vacuums and Vegemite to the sports industry here in the US?

Simple. Because both of those products were sold with a "market the crap out of them, show me the money" attitude to somewhat indifferent customer base, which you're advocating.

Notice that even MLS has jumped into this "market the crap out of it" attitude now with their David Beckham signing in 2007. They've been in existance since 1996 and had to take an organic growth approach since then. Would it have made sense for MLS to sign Romario, Roberto Baggio etc. back in 1996 and "market the crap out of them" back then? Of course not. They did try things like Luis Hernandez, Donadoni, Lothar Mattheus, Freddy Adu in intervening years. But in terms of glitz and amount of money spent, none of the come even close to the David Beckham fanfare.

What you're advocating with cricket in USA is the equivalent of MLS signing a David Beckham alike back in 1996 (closest analogy I can think of is Romario or Roberto Baggio, even they didn't come close in terms of global brandname recognition).
 
Re: only Yanks can revitalize world cricket

Chandu;125230 said:
I think the Sky Dome in Toronto is one of the best places to watch cricket in North America. They had held official international ODIs between India vs. Pakistan a number of times. I was there once. They can open up the roof, if I remember it right. It was in the month of September and somehow there were no clashes with Blue Jays baseball schedule.

I heard Blue Jays are interested in leaving Sky Dome to build their own stadium somewhere else. If that happens, Sky Dome should be declared official home of cricket for all of North America. Weather in the summer is fantastic in Toronto. Nothing would be better than holding cricket tournaments under CN Tower as annual tradition.
isn't that artifical grass? it would be sweet if they could put some real grass in there and a proper wicket!
 
Re: only Yanks can revitalize world cricket

What you're advocating with cricket in USA is the equivalent of MLS signing a David Beckham alike back in 1996 (closest analogy I can think of is Romario or Roberto Baggio, even they didn't come close in terms of global brandname recognition).

You're not even close to what I was advocating and not even close to comparing it to Beckham. "Show me the money" means give the US something to acheive at the end of the rainbow. Give the US an incentive to want to learn to play cricket and be good at it. I think if there was a $1 million prize, like I was saying before, a lot of cricketers and non-cricketers in the US will want to be great at playing cricket in the US because there is $1 million at the end of the rainbow. There is nothing like that now, so the quality of play here is ****. I'm not handing the $1 million to any one team, they have to earn it by winning the championship. Beckham was "given the money" and he hasnt even won a championship or done anything on the field. Total reverse of my goal in "show me the money". And the fact that Beckham was "given the money" is all the more reason MLS will fail. Paying washed-up athletes millions before they even hit the field is not the way to go with MLS.
 
Re: only Yanks can revitalize world cricket

kudu;127861 said:
And the fact that Beckham was "given the money" is all the more reason MLS will fail. Paying washed-up athletes millions before they even hit the field is not the way to go with MLS.

Just because you claim "MLS will fail" doesn't mean it will happen. Also BTW, Romario or Baggio were not washed up back in 1996 like Beckham is in 2007.

There is nobody to give any freebies of $1 million for cricket in USA. Even that Centrex hoax which couldn't have possibly supported such high prize money turned out to be bogus. So basically the original argument you made was pretty vacuous, equivalent to me wishing that I win lottery tomorrow.
 
Re: only Yanks can revitalize world cricket

Also BTW, Romario or Baggio were not washed up back in 1996 like Beckham is in 2007.

Im sorry did I miss something here, when did Romario and Baggio play in the MLS?? That IS what we are talking about, MLS, right?? At least that is what Im referring to. MLS signing washed up players like Beckham will be the demise of the league.

You abviously missed the whole message I was trying to get across with $1 million idea, and that is, there are no incentives in the US to play high caliber cricket and no marketing to get the sport into the spotlight. Yes I realize the Centrex is a hoax. Yes I realize USACA is crap. Yes I realize $1 million is a lot of money. But that is what Americans want. "Show America the money" and Americans will learn to play cricket and put together great teams, and want to earn that "$1 million dollars" at the end of the rainbow. You're taking my message way to literally and not looking beyond what I am trying to get at. Best of luck with that lottery ticket you bought for tomorrow.
 
Re: only Yanks can revitalize world cricket

kudu;127896 said:
Im sorry did I miss something here, when did Romario and Baggio play in the MLS?? That IS what we are talking about, MLS, right??

If you go back to this post where I referred to those 2 guys for the first time, you'll get the context:

http://www.bigcricket.com/forum/showpost.php?p=127810&postcount=79

You abviously missed the whole message I was trying to get across with $1 million idea...

No, I didn't miss it. But I pretty much know those are vacuous ideas, so don't help in any way. At least an "organic growth" approach like what MLS took would be a lot more realiastic, even though that's fraught with too many perils too.
 
Re: only Yanks can revitalize world cricket

If you go back to this post where I referred to those 2 guys for the first time, you'll get the context:

I fully got the context, but what you thought I was advocating was totally wrong. Cricket isnt signing anybody with the $1 million "proposed" dollars. Organic growth for cricket will go nowhere. It needs national attention/marketing and opportunities like soccer has had in the past. Then you will see it climb above soccer.
 
Re: only Yanks can revitalize world cricket

It needs national attention/marketing and opportunities like soccer has had in the past. Then you will see it climb above soccer.

So what do you suggest then, holding the 20/20 world cup, the ODI world cup, champions trophy or australia v rest of the world. Soccers years ahead of cricket when it comes national attention/marketing. Ask any australian who they support in NFL and the'll give that strange look like what are you talking about. It takes time, development, infrastructure and money. Sorry there's no quick fix, first step 20/20 then ODI but first the US has to qualify for a world cup for it all to happen. Its not like a club footy side you cant just start up a side then go and get the players, you have to develop that talent first. Look if cricket was run along the lines soccer they'd have their own side in a world club league, thats why soccer is easier to develop in non soccer countries because you can go out and buy a player to play in the local club competition, do you really think shane warne would go and play cricket in the US right now. Look face it soccers's ahead of cricket at the moment and its going to take it a long time to get in front. Theres no quick fix.
 
Re: only Yanks can revitalize world cricket

So what do you suggest then, holding the 20/20 world cup, the ODI world cup, champions trophy or australia v rest of the world. Soccers years ahead of cricket when it comes national attention/marketing. Ask any australian who they support in NFL and the'll give that strange look like what are you talking about. It takes time, development, infrastructure and money. Sorry there's no quick fix, first step 20/20 then ODI but first the US has to qualify for a world cup for it all to happen. Its not like a club footy side you cant just start up a side then go and get the players, you have to develop that talent first. Look if cricket was run along the lines soccer they'd have their own side in a world club league, thats why soccer is easier to develop in non soccer countries because you can go out and buy a player to play in the local club competition, do you really think shane warne would go and play cricket in the US right now. Look face it soccers's ahead of cricket at the moment and its going to take it a long time to get in front. Theres no quick fix.

First off, I never said cricket is currently surpassing soccer in the US. Of course soccer is years ahead because they have been given so many opportunities to succeed in the US and have failed many times. 20/20 cricket has never been given an opportunity, like soccer has in the past. Of course you are going to need to develop talent, but here in the US of A, you will need to give us an incentive to want to learn how to play and be great at the sport. And no I dont think Warne would come to the US right now, but once the 20/20 gets into the mainstream in the US, he would be great for marketing the sport, not playing the sport like Beckham is doing with soccer in the US, just marketing and maybe setting up some coaching clinics around the country.
 
Re: only Yanks can revitalize world cricket

kudu;127996 said:
And no I dont think Warne would come to the US right now, but once the 20/20 gets into the mainstream in the US, he would be great for marketing the sport, not playing the sport like Beckham is doing with soccer in the US, just marketing and maybe setting up some coaching clinics around the country.

Warne would be a great asset as would many others from ENG and AUS. Most are decent looking, well spoken and have abit of flair ie: Pieterson, Flintoff and Warne. Americans can relate to these guys. Like I say, eventually someone is going to really hit the jackpot here in the US. It's just a matter of time
 
Re: only Yanks can revitalize world cricket

eventually someone is going to really hit the jackpot here in the US. It's just a matter of time

Exactly. 20/20 cricket is such a marketable sport, virtually untapped here in the US. A new frontier, so to speak, in the world of US sports.
 
Re: only Yanks can revitalize world cricket

kudu;128015 said:
Exactly. 20/20 cricket is such a marketable sport, virtually untapped here in the US. A new frontier, so to speak, in the world of US sports.
The possibilities are endless. You have to rememeber that Cricket is essentially the oldest sport in US history. Why the heck do you think I buy a couple powerball tickets every week. So if I ever hit the jackpot I can get this game going. The thing that kind of irritates me is the fact that we have alot of expat millionaires in the US and none of them do anything for the game. As I referenced in another post, the ST Columba's club in Newport,Rhode Island has the Nicest Venue in New England. This is because Dr. Arnow (kindly old gent) owns the land and lets the club use it free of charge and they treat it with respect and maintain it impeccably. This is just one small example of what one person can do to help. When you play a match there it is a top notch experience.
 
Re: only Yanks can revitalize world cricket

theswami;128007 said:
Warne would be a great asset as would many others from ENG and AUS. Most are decent looking, well spoken and have abit of flair ie: Pieterson, Flintoff and Warne.
Barring Flintoff the Americans would need to lock their women away and close down the nightspots for the length of their contracts.
Like I say, eventually someone is going to really hit the jackpot here in the US. It's just a matter of time
Maybe yes, but it would need to be marketed correctly from the word go. You've got to keep in mind that baseball would see it as a threat and would go out of it's way to discredit it, and at this point in time baseball would have the clout, support and dollars to do exactly that. So while I think the possibility is there for it to take off, the planning and marketing part is crucial.
 
Re: only Yanks can revitalize world cricket

You've got to keep in mind that baseball would see it as a threat and would go out of it's way to discredit it

I disagree. I think baseball would love it. Keep in mind there are 162 games in a season in baseball. If you build a schedule where fans of baseball can go to cricket games when the home teams are away, I think it would work. And I think both sports will actually feed off of one another in so many ways.

Barring Flintoff the Americans would need to lock their women away and close down the nightspots

Thats alright. Theres plenty of women in Hollywood who wont mind the attention.


Prove it chandu! Prove that my statement that you are referencing is a contradiction.
 
Re: only Yanks can revitalize world cricket

Bluto11;127846 said:
isn't that artifical grass? it would be sweet if they could put some real grass in there and a proper wicket!

You know, to be honest with you, I might not be correct about that "SkyDome" part. It was such a long time ago, in September of 2007. It was the first time ever I had visited Toronto, visited CN Tower, seen the Sky Dome, done all those touristy things and then went to the ODI. I think I'm getting the actual place where ODI happened mixed up with SkyDome, as it was 10 years ago. Let me check cricinfo records to find out the exact name of the place where it was.

EDIT:

OK, here it is. Sorry for the mixup, the actual name of the place was "Toronto Cricket, Skating and Curling Club". I only went to one out of those five ODIs, I forget which one.

http://usa.cricinfo.com/db/ARCHIVE/1997/OD_TOURNEYS/SAHARA/

But yes, talking about the SkyDome itself. Sure it would be great to get some real grass put in there and once the Blue Jays get the **** out of there, have it declared as the "North American venue" for cricket. Sort of like the MCG or Lords in this part of the world.
 
Re: only Yanks can revitalize world cricket

kudu;128048 said:
I disagree. I think baseball would love it. Keep in mind there are 162 games in a season in baseball. If you build a schedule where fans of baseball can go to cricket games when the home teams are away, I think it would work. And I think both sports will actually feed off of one another in so many ways.
Sorry but I can't see it like that. Are you saying that the baseball fraternity which has been embedded in the American way of life for a million years would take the friendly approach to a sport thats trying to muscle it's way in on their market? And it would be their market. Human nature and the almighty dollar would suggest otherwise. Again I'm not saying it won't work but there will be some boat rocking along the way. As I said the initial marketing and development side will be crucial. Americans are a lot like Australians in that you have to win them over, and initially they will be skeptical and will be hard to get them to even come along.

It will hit the deck a few times before anything happens, but where I do agree is that it will eventually win the people over and things will settle into an even market because it is a great game. What is required is a few "money people" who are prepared to have the guts to stick it out and not be frightened off by a couple of early set backs. It takes time to win people over. However it would eventually happen. But don't be naive in believing the baseball people will take kindly to it. They'll see it as someone attempting to rant on their parade.
 
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