Wrist Spin Bowling

Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Contributors
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

leggielaw;344310 said:
if ur a natural leg spinner it shouldnt take long to get ur line and length back, but if your not then it will take longer.

i just found out grimmet bowled fast/medium before converting to legspin which i also did, i guess we both viewed the magnificent art of leg spin and took it up, i took leg spin up at 15 and now pushing for my county team at age 17 :) guess we're naturals:p
Click to expand...

County team! Good work LL, let us know how you get on, how does your captain treat you as a leg spinner, does he give you your overs willingly and use you as an attack player or is he more inclined to use you when he's run out of ideas?
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

i have a question, i can spin hard spun legbreaks hand to hand with the third finger but i get a sore elbow, Why? And i can spin hardspun legbreaks round arm ( As Phillpott suggests) But for some reason i can't do it underarm? Also when i bowl normally the ball still spins even though i haven't spun it as hardest as i can, So how can i spin the ball hard just like i do hand to hand and experiencing the burn of friction in the third finger.
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

Ripping-LegBreak;344315 said:
Same i took up legspin at the age of 15 aswell, Im 16 now so im not that experienced yet but i do have a decent stock legbreak and i remember the first time i bowled legspin, It was very satisfying watching the ball zip to the left as a result of the graceful mechanism of the wrist. This season im hoping to develop my legspin skills further by hoping to create some variety, I have known to accidently bowl the sidespinner which happened like once in 50 balls. So i hope i can further understand my action better and go from there. Can i ask are you, do you have a front on action or a side on action, For me im inbetween but my hips and shoulders are in line so basically everythings going toward middlestump which is my natural line.
Click to expand...

Ripping Legbreak - if I was you I'd try and learn the Top-spinner as it's such an easy progression and the amount of dip you can get off it with a bit of practice is amazing, you bowl it hard and it looks as though it should pitching way beyond the stumps and then it just falls out of the sky - it is such a lovely ball. From there learn the Flipper - do as Macca suggests - use a smaller a ball - tennis balls are good and just learn to give it a good click out of the fingers like this - YouTube - Clarrie Grimmett Flipper Wrist spin bowling A it'll take some time to get your accuracy line and length right but it is so worth it when you use this in combination with the Top Spinner.
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

Ripping-LegBreak;344461 said:
i have a question, i can spin hard spun legbreaks hand to hand with the third finger but i get a sore elbow, Why?
Click to expand...
How long have you had the sore elbow? Does it hurt to throw? have you thrown your arm out? Could be golfers/tennis elbow, can be caused by throwing. If it lasts more than a fortnight and doesn't heal through rest you might have to see a quack.
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

hmmm yeah i've tried the toppy a couple of times but it still came out like a legbreak due to the natural movement of the wrist to the left, I think i have a new theory. instead of my hand going over the ball on release for the toppy what if i bowl it from the back of the hand with the wrist cocked and flicking it straight without any finger involvement, i reckon it wont bounce but it'll still go straight right, with the seam vertical of course . I got this idea from the fastbowlers slower delivery with the seam vertical but coming out from the back of the hand. What do you guys think?
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

Unspinable;344450 said:
I normally put it on about middle-off and fairly full, turning it to slips, But I get smashed alot so I don't know if thats good for T20.
Click to expand...
Middle-off line sounds O.K, fairly full length is better than short, but you mustn't overpitch. Length varies according to lots of things but somewhere Grimmett says a good length ball for a legspinner is roughly about 4 yards in front of the stumps. Which seems too short.
You mostly have to try and bring the batsman forward but it has to be short enough so he cant get to you on the half volley or full easily, but not so short he can get on the backfoot and punish you, it depends on the batsmans strengths, it helps if you know if he favours front-foot or back-foot play before you even bowl to him.
Watch the batsmans footwork and if he is a frontfoot player he may start edging towards you before you even deliver the ball and a backfoot player may begin moving his backfoot back and across early in the delivery. If he is predominantly a backfoot player keep the ball up, and if he favours the backfoot, pitch it up a bit further. If he is good both ways , then it gets harder.
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

Ripping-LegBreak;344372 said:
hmmm yeah i've tried the toppy a couple of times but it still came out like a legbreak due to the natural movement of the wrist to the left, I think i have a new theory. instead of my hand going over the ball on release for the toppy what if i bowl it from the back of the hand with the wrist cocked and flicking it straight without any finger involvement, i reckon it wont bounce but it'll still go straight right, with the seam vertical of course . I got this idea from the fastbowlers slower delivery with the seam vertical but coming out from the back of the hand. What do you guys think?
Click to expand...


No. You've got to think in terms of your hand being dead straight, see Legspin bowling: The Top Spinner maybe have the thumb off the ball and concentrate on having the side of your wrist facing the bat, it should come in time also have a vertical arm rather than a round arm action.
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

the elbow is not sore it only hurts when i spin the ball really hard from hand to hand and i hear a crack in my elbow then it doesent hurt anymore basically i think i use my wrist too much and thats what causes the unneccesary pain in the elbow joint, I do not use my fingers very often so that might be the case , if i use my fingers i tend to drag it down. What do you think?
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

:eek: I've got a problem... I have come to the conclusion that I can bowl a better wrong 'un than leg break. That doesn't seem right. My leg break is almost straight, and low... Almost like a flipper. My wrong 'un moves more than three feet. Is there anything seriously wrong with me, or can I just not bowl a leg break?
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

Ripping-LegBreak;344492 said:
the elbow is not sore it only hurts when i spin the ball really hard from hand to hand and i hear a crack in my elbow then it doesent hurt anymore basically i think i use my wrist too much and thats what causes the unneccesary pain in the elbow joint, I do not use my fingers very often so that might be the case , if i use my fingers i tend to drag it down. What do you think?
Click to expand...

lol i know what ur doing.... your tensing the muscles around ur elbow and ur all stiff and tight, what you need to do is relax the power of ur delivery comes from many elements and your trying to force it, just relax ur elbow and have a loose grip on the ball and flick the wrist and let it roll of your 3rd finger, hope this solves your problem. The more your wrist is relaxed the more of a flick you can give the ball.
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

You've got the Googly Syndrome. Which is a fatal error if you're serious about being a wrist spin bowler. It's taken me more than six months of intensive re-training to correct this (Might have been longer). It's a common problem amongst wrist spinners, once you reach a point where you can bowl the leg break you then go looking to bowl the variations and quite often the next one that you choose is the Wrong un/Googly. But if you heed the advice of anyone in the know they advise that as you learn it you should continue to bowl Leg Breaks primarily. So the training regime needs to be something along the lines of 'For every 7 Leg Break balls then try the wrong un'. Which if you want to bowl it makes no sense whatsoever in the short term. The problem is - in order to bowl the Wrong Un it is so radically a different action that if done intensively it leads to a kind of re-wiring of your brain that then means your natural action is the wrong un action. It's like driving a car - when you first get in a manual car you're asked to do so many things that it doesn't come easy but with training and practice it comes together. Bowling the Wrong Un in a way is like then getting another car with all the foot pedals, steering wheel, hand break all in the oppoiste places , so you have to re-learn how to now drive this new car, which would obviously mean that when you went back to a normal car that would feel totally alien again? Thus you'd have to re-learn it.

So this is what you've got to do as a wrist spinner - you've got to stop bowling wrong uns and re-learn the leg break. It's not going to be easy but it'll come.
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

leggielaw;344501 said:
lol i know what ur doing.... your tensing the muscles around ur elbow and ur all stiff and tight, what you need to do is relax the power of ur delivery comes from many elements and your trying to force it, just relax ur elbow and have a loose grip on the ball and flick the wrist and let it roll of your 3rd finger, hope this solves your problem. The more your wrist is relaxed the more of a flick you can give the ball.
Click to expand...

Yes that could be the problem and the answer. This is what Benaud says "...the wrist should be cocked, but DEFINITELY NOT (his emphasis) stiffly cocked, which would prevent flexibility and , in delivery, would give you the feeling the ball was simply falling out of your fingers." Which is what leggielaw is saying , I think.
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

someblokecalleddave;344364 said:
County team! Good work LL, let us know how you get on, how does your captain treat you as a leg spinner, does he give you your overs willingly and use you as an attack player or is he more inclined to use you when he's run out of ideas?
Click to expand...

Yes sad tht my captain only uses me when all seamers have been whacked around the park and then throws me the ball and expects me to get a wicket or hold up one end, which as a bowler you like to create pressure for the batsmen not come on when the batsmen is pressuring you! , but thats the good thing about spin as batsmen are over confident and i often get alot of catches from my bowling after they try to slog me.
I wish i had a captain with more faith in spin!
he tends to bowl an off spinner before me tht is supremly flat and doesnt go for many runs, yet i put alot of revs with dip, flight etc.. and sometimes i can get whacked for a few 4's nd 6's but i always get wickets and even tho my economoy is averagely higher than the offie i garentuee wickets, but to my captain containment is bettr than wickets :/

wats ur views on this?
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

Ripping-LegBreak;344461 said:
And i can spin hardspun legbreaks round arm ( As Phillpott suggests) But for some reason i can't do it underarm?
Click to expand...
I bet you already can. It is the opposite of roundarm, and it feels funny at first because everything is upside down and reversed. With your palm facing up, and the back of the hand facing the ground, you are flicking it left to right rather than right to left. Start off over a short distance, against a wall is good, or to another legspinner is ideal.
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

someblokecalleddave;344403 said:
You've got the Googly Syndrome. So the training regime needs to be something along the lines of 'For every 7 Leg Break balls then try the wrong un'.
So this is what you've got to do as a wrist spinner - you've got to stop bowling wrong uns and re-learn the leg break. It's not going to be easy but it'll come.
Click to expand...

OK... I don't bowl it that often, I don't think. I generally bowl 6 balls in a pattern: Leg Break, Topspinner, Leg Break, Leg Break, Wrong 'Un, Leg Break. And then repeat. I know it's not 7 leg breaks to a wrong 'un, but it can't be messing me up that badly, can it? :confused:

Could it be that the ground I'm using to bowl on isn't exactly level? I have to go out to a park, find a tree, mark off the distance to the bowling crease and bowl at the tree, since you can't get a wicket in America... :(

... Or could it be that I've taught myself to bowl a flipper instead of the leg break?
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

macca;344473 said:
. If he is predominantly a backfoot player keep the ball up, and if he favours the backfoot, pitch it up a bit further.
Click to expand...

That should read " if he is predominantly a backfoot player pitch the ball up, and if he favours the frontfoot, try pitching it a bit shorter "
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

Cotton Eye Joe;344418 said:
OK... I don't bowl it that often, I don't think. I generally bowl 6 balls in a pattern: Leg Break, Topspinner, Leg Break, Leg Break, Wrong 'Un, Leg Break. And then repeat. I know it's not 7 leg breaks to a wrong 'un, but it can't be messing me up that badly, can it? :confused:

Could it be that the ground I'm using to bowl on isn't exactly level? I have to go out to a park, find a tree, mark off the distance to the bowling crease and bowl at the tree, since you can't get a wicket in America... :(

... Or could it be that I've taught myself to bowl a flipper instead of the leg break?
Click to expand...

im no expert on googly syndrome but i do know that some people are naturally googly bowlers, so maybe this is why
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

Well, if you're a wrist spinner you should have a decent Leg Break, I've noticed that some wrist spinners are credited as being primarily googly bowlers and that's their stock ball, but a lot of blokes on this thread have always advised me during the dark period when I could only bowl googlies to get the leg break back. Your googly should be a variation. My googly was a fantastic ball when it was my stock ball, but bowled as your stock ball it loses it's effectiveness. All the blokes on my team that bowl a good leg break get far more wickets than me and they've got no variations, so logically if I could produce a 'Good' leg break the Googly with it's surprise element suddenly becomes so much more effective? I would recommend that you bowl the leg break as your stock ball - Philpott would say that it's the way to go - I think Jenner says this too in his on-line videos as well.
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

leggielaw;344501 said:
lol i know what ur doing.... your tensing the muscles around ur elbow and ur all stiff and tight, what you need to do is relax the power of ur delivery comes from many elements and your trying to force it, just relax ur elbow and have a loose grip on the ball and flick the wrist and let it roll of your 3rd finger, hope this solves your problem. The more your wrist is relaxed the more of a flick you can give the ball.
Click to expand...

Yeah I'm in agreement with the comment here, you're using one lever rather than all the levers and the finger as far as I'm concerned is essential, you've just got to persevere with the fact that if you bring the finger into your action you drag it down - you've just got to learn not to drag it down - maybe the idea that you push the ball forward might help?
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

Cotton Eye Joe;344418 said:
OK... I don't bowl it that often, I don't think. I generally bowl 6 balls in a pattern: Leg Break, Topspinner, Leg Break, Leg Break, Wrong 'Un, Leg Break. And then repeat. I know it's not 7 leg breaks to a wrong 'un, but it can't be messing me up that badly, can it? :confused:

Could it be that the ground I'm using to bowl on isn't exactly level? I have to go out to a park, find a tree, mark off the distance to the bowling crease and bowl at the tree, since you can't get a wicket in America... :(

... Or could it be that I've taught myself to bowl a flipper instead of the leg break?
Click to expand...

The Flipper is very different to a Leg Break, you're either bowling one or the other, you'll have to look at all the on-line resources and see what it is you're bowling. It could be down to bowling on a rough surface. Do you mean stumps when you say 'Wickets'?
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

someblokecalleddave;344421 said:
The Flipper is very different to a Leg Break, you're either bowling one or the other, you'll have to look at all the on-line resources and see what it is you're bowling. It could be down to bowling on a rough surface. Do you mean stumps when you say 'Wickets'?
Click to expand...

Wicket = set of three stumps and two bails... right? It's also the term used to say a batsman is out. His wicket is taken, right? :confused:

Anyway, the flipper is like a leg break, but it straightens and stays low upon pitching, right? That's what I get when I try a leg break - a ball that pitches, moves almost straight afterwords, and stays within 3 inches of the ground.

someblokecalleddave said:
It could be down to bowling on a rough surface.
Click to expand...
Can you rephrase that? I don't quite understand. Are you saying that it could be that the ground is making it turn that way, rather than something wrong with my action?
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

Macca, I think whether predominantely a front or backfoot player, jenner says the aim is to make the batsman drive. So as you say the length should be a drivable one. Though at our level it is one thing to say it and fantasy to carry it out.
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

It is not only in america that there are no wickets. I think none of us has afull size wicket where we live. We tend to improvise. For example on a tennis court i find if i bowl from the service line on one side, the baseline on the other side is about the area where the batting crease would be, a further 1.2 metres behind the stumps would be located.

As regards the problem with the leg break i think getting philpotts book and reading and re-reading it helps no end(we should get a commission here). The way is start hand to hand, then underarm, then roundarm, then overarm over SHORT distances. Dave will tell you all about it.

Ripping LB, if you do not use your thumb to spin the ball, the thumb gives you an indication where the ball will spin. So it should point to the batsman. What i find is that if i release it before the position where i release the leg break ie before i pivot, the tendency is to bowl a topspinner. Also possibly keeping your hand /forearm more vertical may help as well. But do not get too fussed, having a good leg break is important especially if you rip it and have good accuracy. Apparently the movement going away from the batsman like an outswinger is much more dangerous.

Today i had a problem, I could not get the ball to go straight except with the flipper. Even the topspinner that really spat up high off the surface had some break in it. Despite the break it would not threaten the stumps as it goes pst the offside.I do not seem to have changed much of the action except for slowing the run up , increasing the pivot and possibly releasing the ball a bit later. Do not worry dave i have not beaten you to the massive leg break yet, but i would call it a medium leg break. Unfortunately i tend to bowl a leg stump or outside leg stump line despite my best efforts. Also tried the jenner backspinner over 22 yards, but i feel i may be chucking it, but it kept lowish even though off line.
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

Dave he used to practice with a stump and a golf ball. Though I doubt whether this would be the main reason of his success. I am sure many of his generation practiced in some similar way. The truth is he was a great athlete, with great hand eye co-ordination, and great reflexes allied to his light bat that allowed him an array of shots ( i think it weighed 2lbs2oz). I may try a size 6 bat , i will be pleased with an average of 50. So thinking that the next batsman averaged 35 runs less means that this man was from another planet, could he be an extraterrestrial. By the way his wrist spin seemed to be very good if you have seen his averages.
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

Cotton Eye Joe;344423 said:
Wicket = set of three stumps and two bails... right? It's also the term used to say a batsman is out. His wicket is taken, right? :confused:

Yeah - tricky one this one the word wicket is used to describe many things - Wicket - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia but I thought you were using the term to describe your lack of stumps?

Anyway, the flipper is like a leg break, but it straightens and stays low upon pitching, right? That's what I get when I try a leg break - a ball that pitches, moves almost straight afterwords, and stays within 3 inches of the ground.

This sounds as though you're bowling Flippers - are you clicking your finger and thumb together to squeeze the ball out of the hand to produce backspin? If you are you're bowling flippers and maybe your Flipper is like mine and turns towards the off-side like a leg break? The leg break has completely different characteristics - it bounces well and might have some dip.

Can you rephrase that? I don't quite understand. Are you saying that it could be that the ground is making it turn that way, rather than something wrong with my action?
Click to expand...

If you're bowling onto a rough surface you might find that you'll get more turn with a lesser amount of spin. If the surface is slightly angled the ball will have a tendency to turn downhill and this will have a beneficial affect on the ball if you're trying to spin it in the direction of the slope.
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

Do you guys tend to pitch too full or too short. Macca showed us how grimmett would have erred towards pitching fuller. I have a tendency to pitch shorter, about 5 yards from the batsman's crease despite the energy i put in run up etc. I think it might be that I get predominantely topspin. The only full delivery being the flipper that is usually nearly a yorker with a bit of swing inwards.
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

Any news on the wings to fly and the grimmett book, dave? Did you have any time to practice or was it soggy , as at Lords they did not play today. By the way we may get to see warne for 4 overs at IPL matches. They played today and lost but he took a wicket.
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

Wings to fly was at the Post Office for collection today apparently so I should be picking it up this coming Thursday? The Grimmett book - they had a problem with my card, it sounded like the shop was run by some old dear and she was having aggro with the card machine and she eventually gave up saying 'If you want it send me a cheque' so I've still yet to do that. I've located the other book that Macca mentioned - 'Grimmett on cricket' (I think that was the name) but it's in a shop in Australia, so I've got to work out the costs to see if I can justify buying it.

On another subject I've been looking at different variations of the game to play with smaller numbers and came across this which is funny - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backyard_cricket
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

sadspinner;344528 said:
Do you guys tend to pitch too full or too short. Macca showed us how grimmett would have erred towards pitching fuller. I have a tendency to pitch shorter, about 5 yards from the batsman's crease despite the energy i put in run up etc. I think it might be that I get predominantely topspin. The only full delivery being the flipper that is usually nearly a yorker with a bit of swing inwards.
Click to expand...

We're always told by our captain who bowls Chinaman himself to pitch it up fuller, but with Top Spin shorter might work because it rushes on and comes up into the face, although personally I'd go a bit fuller than 5 yards from the crease.
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

Yes where I practice is concrete so the bounce gets high and misses the stump height. I still have not managed to develop a straight ball consistently as even the topspinners have a small element of sidespin.
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

I'm my teams spin bowler and in a couple of weeks we will be doing some T20 games. How should I bowl for T20, should I stay the same or change my tactics?

Cheers,
unspinable
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

Never seen a chinaman bowl except katich and hogg. Is he accurate, does he turn it at all, and does he take shedloads of wickets? Be discrete, he might be keeping an eye on you. Remember the season is nigh.
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

You'd be surprised at how much a top spinner bounces on most surfaces. On the field I practice on I'm always surprised that despite the fact that it's damp and soggy at this time of year the difference in bounce the top spinner produces is very dramatic compared to all the others - enough to force a mistake off the glove or top of the bat if used deftly. I've just left an apt comment in one of the batting threads just to wind them all up in the style of Mr Grimett - http://www.bigcricket.com/forum/t65045-2/#post344522 just a bit of fun!
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

Unspinable;344431 said:
I'm my teams spin bowler and in a couple of weeks we will be doing some T20 games. How should I bowl for T20, should I stay the same or change my tactics?

Cheers,
unspinable
Click to expand...

What do you do normally? I'd imagine what with it being a game where you're looking to make runs with every ball virtually - the batsman has got to be aggressive and look to dominate you? That to me sounds like you should be in for some wickets - how soon to the they play you normally?

I've just looked at who's on line and there's 5 people 4 of whom are wrist spinners that contribute to this thread!

NZ and India are on-line at the minute with Vettori bowling, it could be a long night as it 00.08hrs here in the UK!
 
Re: Wrist Spin Bowling

Yes read that, they will sh'""# in their pants reading it. Though I doubt they have the culture to know who grimmett was. Warne showed us that with words and bullying he could take many wickets, Grimmett as well. So could be a ploy you could try when a new batsman comes in. You just have to hope he does not hit you for a four or six and tell you to go and fetch the ball
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top